yeah, i'm now old enough to have lived through several of my straight friends divorces and all I can say as the bystander to this is that people who are going to get married should really talk together- a lot- about what being married means to each party, and what it doesn't mean. I have now seen a mis-match of expectations about marriage and crushing disappointment wreck at least three marriages (tho happily other straight friends are able to keep on trucking). Sucks.
― twice boiled cabbage is death, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:33 (3 years ago) Permalink
Breakups and divorces really aren't the same thing IMO.
I dunno, I think it depends on the nature or duration of the relationship.
― sarahel, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:33 (3 years ago) Permalink
harbl i think u just need to be like hey i'm here if you need anything; maybe check in with her every couple weeks unless she tells you to step off
― call all destroyer, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:41 (3 years ago) Permalink
yeah we don't even live in the same state anymore so it's hard. she seemed like she just needed something to occupy her time so i'm kinda like uh, can't help u. fortunately they already lived separate because she's still in school and he works in another city. i dunno i don't really have a problem just like wow, what would i do, you know?
― welcome to gudbergur (harbl), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:44 (3 years ago) Permalink
it happens, rite
is that why they're divorcing?
― sarahel, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:45 (3 years ago) Permalink
send her some flowers or a nice present imo
― max, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:45 (3 years ago) Permalink
from my friends' experience - with both divorces and break ups of really long-term relationships - the things that make it the hardest are when kids or shared property (houses, businesses) are involved.
Call all Destroyer's advice is good.
― sarahel, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:49 (3 years ago) Permalink
i don't even know exactly why. i really didn't ask. i figured she would tell me sometime and i don't really have my own curiosity about this shit (not a gossiper? i don't know). i can guess well enough. they don't have any property either which is good! this is gonna be a breeze really
― welcome to gudbergur (harbl), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:51 (3 years ago) Permalink
for you or for your friend?
― sarahel, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:51 (3 years ago) Permalink
for her! not really but a lot better than it could be
― welcome to gudbergur (harbl), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:52 (3 years ago) Permalink
not a problem for me if i'm not making this clear. just thinkin baout things, wishing i could have more empathy sometimes
― welcome to gudbergur (harbl), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:55 (3 years ago) Permalink
did they try seeing a therapist together? i have found it to be very helpful, but sometimes things are too far gone.
― velko, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 04:04 (3 years ago) Permalink
nah i don't think it can be repaired, i think it might be for the best in the long run tbh
― welcome to gudbergur (harbl), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 04:13 (3 years ago) Permalink
If they're not even living in the same area, unless they had definite plans to do so in the future, I don't see the point in being married/in a relationship.
― sarahel, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 04:15 (3 years ago) Permalink
well some people see points in different things i guess
― welcome to gudbergur (harbl), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 04:19 (3 years ago) Permalink
yes they do, but at that point, if it were me, I'd be asking myself a bunch of questions.
― sarahel, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 04:20 (3 years ago) Permalink
i don't think distance had that much to do with it but i'm not gonna spell out all the other reasons for the internet
― welcome to gudbergur (harbl), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 04:27 (3 years ago) Permalink
Two of my very old good friends finalized their divorce yesterday. They were kind of my substitute parents when I moved away from home after high school to start college, both about 6 or 7 years older than I am, but always seemed far more wise than their age would dictate. I was there for the birth of their first child, spent many many hours at their house, and even sublet it from them when they moved to Denver for a couple years. A few months ago, the wife left for another guy. It wasn't sinister or anything. She wasn't sneaking around. But their relationship was clearly over. The husband had been pretty upbeat about it and going with the flow of the divorce... UNTIL TODAY. Maybe it was too soon, but the (ex) wife announced her new engagement today on Facebook and he FLIPPED THE FUCK OUT calling everyone who was congratulating her "false friends" and "inappropriate bitches".
Yeah, I concede that getting engaged the day after your divorce is final is probably a little selfish or, at the least, insensitive, but it was going to happen sooner or later.
My dilemma is that, while I still want to remain friends with the (ex) husband, it's going to be hard if he's going to be one of those guys who lashes out at people who are still friends with her as well.
How do I deal with this, ILX?
― Johnny Fever, Thursday, 13 May 2010 22:15 (3 years ago) Permalink
Tell him you still like him, but plan to remain friends with his ex, and that while you will do your best not to have the two spheres overlap they may, and if he freaks the fuck out on you then fuck him in the ear because you will not be disrespected.
― Have a slice of wine! (HI DERE), Thursday, 13 May 2010 22:17 (3 years ago) Permalink
You can't be friends w/him if he puts you in the middle this way and you might as well tell him.
― Il suffit de ne pas l'envier (Michael White), Thursday, 13 May 2010 22:19 (3 years ago) Permalink
That is pretty tactless though, announcing that via FB the day after a divorce is finalized.
― he's always been a bit of an anti-climb Max (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Thursday, 13 May 2010 22:20 (3 years ago) Permalink
Hope he'll eventually cool down, and if he doesn't you'll, sadly, probably have to take her or his side.
― my baby's got the bans (ksh), Thursday, 13 May 2010 22:21 (3 years ago) Permalink
Yes, it is. And dude has a right to say so but not to make his friends draw lines in the sand over it. Just because he's close to the issuse doesn't mean their other common friends have to be unforgiving about such a gaffe.
― Il suffit de ne pas l'envier (Michael White), Thursday, 13 May 2010 22:23 (3 years ago) Permalink
Oh I agree with your advice and he reacted horribly, but, I'm sure it has to be difficult for him and I would hope that mutual friends might also be a little understanding of the tough mental space he's in. I'm sure he'll regret some of the things he said with time.
― he's always been a bit of an anti-climb Max (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Thursday, 13 May 2010 22:26 (3 years ago) Permalink
You can't be friends w/him if he puts you in the middle this way
Yeah, I've done all I can the past few months to stay OUT of the middle of this. I most definitely don't want to be dragged in now that they're officially not married anymore.
― Johnny Fever, Thursday, 13 May 2010 22:26 (3 years ago) Permalink
If I were friendly with both of them I might congratulate her privately but I'd have a lot of trouble publicly oohing and ahhing and "liking this" on Facebook tbh. It would be insensitive.
― all yoga attacks are fire based (rogermexico.), Thursday, 13 May 2010 22:56 (3 years ago) Permalink
Ugh, Ive been lashing out at a couple of my friends recently because theyve befriended my ex's new lady, really fast - without apology - and its hard because he hooked up with her 2 days after saying we should break up. Nothing like a divorce, and I'm now just keeping it to myself, but I can understand the reaction. Its been impossibly hard to keep the bitterness and anger to myself. I dont know how it must be for long term marriage bustups.
― Eyjafjallalalalalatrolololol (Trayce), Thursday, 13 May 2010 23:29 (3 years ago) Permalink
facebook ay?
how not to move on...
― not_goodwin, Thursday, 13 May 2010 23:49 (3 years ago) Permalink
what about people who probably SHOULD get a divorce, but don't? I know a few folks who fall into that camp.
― homosexual II, Friday, 14 May 2010 00:15 (3 years ago) Permalink
this brings up the whole, "Why get married in the first place?" question.
love.
― Daniel, Esq., Friday, 14 May 2010 00:17 (3 years ago) Permalink
fear of eternal loneliness & having no one except for ilx posters to "talk" to for the rest of your life
― my baby's got the bans (ksh), Friday, 14 May 2010 00:24 (3 years ago) Permalink
marriage is not a guarantee of being loved and having someone for eternity
― homosexual II, Friday, 14 May 2010 00:40 (3 years ago) Permalink
you're right, it's not a guarantee.
― Daniel, Esq., Friday, 14 May 2010 01:00 (3 years ago) Permalink
Tax breaks.
I kid.
― he's always been a bit of an anti-climb Max (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Friday, 14 May 2010 01:13 (3 years ago) Permalink
I was engaged once. I'm pretty sure if we'd gone through it, we'd have been divorced in three months. I'm not in a rush.
It's totally for some people, though, and I'd never begrudge them the opportunity (even those who announce they're engaged the day following their divorce, no matter how shitty that is to the ex). I wish he would've been using to the separation to work out his issues and I wish she would've waited to announce TO THE WORLD (i.e. all the mutual friends, him, their children) that she's already engaged.
― Johnny Fever, Friday, 14 May 2010 01:18 (3 years ago) Permalink
I was engaged once as well, mainly due to immigration reasons (partner was canadian and gonna move to Aus). That ended, and I am also thankful, cos it really wasn't the right thing to do at all.
― Eyjafjallalalalalatrolololol (Trayce), Friday, 14 May 2010 01:23 (3 years ago) Permalink
The Importance of Hating Your Ex
― mookieproof, Friday, 14 May 2010 02:21 (3 years ago) Permalink
i can see where he's coming from, but yeah tbh fuck taking 'sides'
― May be half naked, but knows a good headline when he sees it (darraghmac), Friday, 14 May 2010 09:03 (3 years ago) Permalink
People who boast about their engagement on FB are just sort of ridiculous anyway. It's like sending all your friends cards telling them you're engaged. WHich some people do. "Jamie and Maria are engaged" with some gold cursive script and a photo of the lovebirds inside. Or possible a little more "craftsy" if the couple has Pixies listening in their past. What is the point of this shit? If I'm really your friend, you're going to tell me about it anyway. If I'm not really your friend, why am I getting this card about your intention to bone one person exclusively for the rest of your life? Doing this on FB is even less personal, and I really wonder about the motivation behind it.
― The Clegg Effect (Tracer Hand), Friday, 14 May 2010 09:36 (3 years ago) Permalink
when your parents start dropping the divorce word (when you yourself are in your thirties): still saddens you. but they won't (i hope). still, it's rather earth shattering. kinda fucking weird, cause you're an adult and you should be able to shrug it off, right?
― Nathalie (stevienixed), Friday, 14 May 2010 09:39 (3 years ago) Permalink
I don't think you could ever casually shrug off something like that...are they already separated?
― Matt #2, Friday, 14 May 2010 10:04 (3 years ago) Permalink
Nath, I hope this comes across in an understanding way, but does this put your mother's attitudes and advice about your own marriage into a different light? That, for me, would be the weirdest part.
― 3-D Whinge-ometer (Masonic Boom), Friday, 14 May 2010 10:09 (3 years ago) Permalink
my parent's looong disaster of a marriage certainly informed my approach to it (ie no fucking way, ever, thanks)
― May be half naked, but knows a good headline when he sees it (darraghmac), Friday, 14 May 2010 10:12 (3 years ago) Permalink
What darraghmac said.
― not_goodwin, Friday, 14 May 2010 10:27 (3 years ago) Permalink
Guys you realize you wouldn't be marrying your parents?
― The Clegg Effect (Tracer Hand), Friday, 14 May 2010 16:56 (3 years ago) Permalink
O RLY?
― all yoga attacks are fire based (rogermexico.), Friday, 14 May 2010 16:57 (3 years ago) Permalink
I really wonder about the motivation behind it.
PRESENTS
― Have a slice of wine! (HI DERE), Friday, 14 May 2010 16:58 (3 years ago) Permalink
Oh yeah.
― The Clegg Effect (Tracer Hand), Friday, 14 May 2010 17:10 (3 years ago) Permalink
my parents are so genuinely fond of each other
especially on mothers day iirc
― mookieproof, Tuesday, 21 August 2012 18:53 (9 months ago) Permalink
oh not just on Mother's Day, believe me
― Lil Swayne of Pie (DJP), Tuesday, 21 August 2012 18:54 (9 months ago) Permalink
Okay! I don't know anything about the statistics and did not look them up before making that post, I just ran with the anecdotal impression from the other posts that people feel like they are seeing a lot of divorces among their peers. And like I said before, I also don't see a lot of non-trad marriages/relationships first-hand and the ones I do see I prob don't give enough thought to the variety of ways in which they are non-traditional, since they still live together, vacation together, have kids together (not all, obvs) that kind of thing, so from the outside it seems p normal. But that could be because they just don't talk about it & dissect it outside of the relationship. They could all be secret weirdos for all I know! In a good way. I guess people who partner each oth long-term but choose not to marry are making a non-traditional choice, especially if they choose not to marry and still to have kids. That kind of thing is interesting to me.
― check the name, no caps, boom, i'm (Laurel), Tuesday, 21 August 2012 21:50 (9 months ago) Permalink
I know a couple that has bought a (very expensive) house and now the woman is actively trying to get pregnant but they are not married and probably never will be and yeah it is interesting
― Shameful Dead Half Choogle (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 21 August 2012 21:53 (9 months ago) Permalink
xp yeah I think at some point if you don't want to live together, vacation together etc. the better option is probably just not getting married. Although there are a fair number of academic married couples, for example, who live apart large parts of the year -- more often childless than not, I think.
I'm also at least acquainted with people who chose to have kids without formal marriage, although I think a lot of things about their arrangements probably are similar to mariage.
As for choosing to have children together and living and/or vacationing separately, I think there are just practical reasons why that doesn't happen that often. For one thing, not having a second person around to help with kids is just going to make it much harder, and I'm not really sure what would be desirable about that.
― bert yansh (Hurting 2), Tuesday, 21 August 2012 21:58 (9 months ago) Permalink
I mean my wife just took K for a few days out of the city without me and then I joined them later on, and she's occasionally done things on her own like an art residency, but we're a pretty traditional married couple overall.
― bert yansh (Hurting 2), Tuesday, 21 August 2012 22:00 (9 months ago) Permalink
fwiw having a stable parents and family b/g doesnt make a guarantee of being ok with relationships. My parents are still together, seem perfectly happy, never had any major fallings out (tho that, at times, was due to mum being a bit of a martyr and just coping with issues that came up and supressing rage marge simpson style, i suspect). Despite being surrounded by perfectly regular fam, with 2 broters married with kids, I appear to be a complete relationship fuckup and am 41 and single again.
― frances boredom coconut (Trayce), Tuesday, 21 August 2012 22:10 (9 months ago) Permalink
I mean my wife just took K for a few days out of the city without me
quoted out of context...
― goole, Tuesday, 21 August 2012 22:33 (9 months ago) Permalink
As a kid I remember feeling very out-of-place in that my parents were still together. And they still are - and they still totally seem to dig each other. They aren't super emotional and affectionate, which kinda skewed my perception of relationships for a while (I didn't realize until very, very recently that I need a lot of affection).
I fully plan on getting divorced one day. ;)
― homosexual II, Tuesday, 21 August 2012 22:40 (9 months ago) Permalink
Nathalie, aren't you also the one who thinks that masturbation is wrong? Or am I thinking of someone else?
Either way, 'sticking it out for the kids' is NOT the best solution imo. Especially if the two parents openly despise one another.
― homosexual II, Tuesday, 21 August 2012 22:41 (9 months ago) Permalink
never said it was. it's just the example I grew up with
― set the controls for the heart of the sun (VegemiteGrrl), Wednesday, 22 August 2012 01:11 (9 months ago) Permalink
I guess I just think sometimes maybe parents could try to find a way not to openly despise each other if they weren't so attached to their personal resentments? But then I guess it's hard for me to imagine getting to that point with someone where you're totally beyond hope, because I'm lucky enough to have a connection with my wife that so far seems to survive difficulties.
― bert yansh (Hurting 2), Wednesday, 22 August 2012 02:17 (9 months ago) Permalink
homo otm the idea of married people staying together for the kids makes my skin itch.
― horseshoe, Wednesday, 22 August 2012 02:24 (9 months ago) Permalink
seriously, people, don't do that to your kids! i remember feeling like the whole world opened up when my parents got divorced, like the air had a different (better) quality. admittedly i am just generalizing from my experience, but everyone else itt is too as far as i can tell, so there.
― horseshoe, Wednesday, 22 August 2012 02:26 (9 months ago) Permalink
I can only speak of what I know from my parents, but I guess the key part that I skipped over was that 'staying together for the kids' is a good cover story. As much as they loved us, I know with almost 100% certainty that we were not why they stayed together. I sat in the car with my mum when I was 15 trying to talk her into just leaving. She knew we knew how bad it was. Part of it was that we grew up in a small town, both my parents pretty much knew everyone in the town and a lot of the reason for not getting divorced/separating was they didn't want the shame of everyone in town knowing that that had happened. Well, my Mum. Pretty much everything we went through stemmed from Mum's fear of being publically humiliated over x y or z. And the other part was just she was a very competitive person and didn't want to lose. Divorce meant that she lost. And she didn't want to lose to my Dad. From what I know of Mum, my guess is that in her mind divorce would mean that she had been wrong about Dad, and god knows she didn't want to be wrong.
Sorry for livejournaling but I just want to make sure you guys get that it's not actually really a literal pact that they made or anything.
― set the controls for the heart of the sun (VegemiteGrrl), Wednesday, 22 August 2012 02:34 (9 months ago) Permalink
And to clarify again, she was pretty OTT during that period. Mum now and Mum then are almost two different people.
― set the controls for the heart of the sun (VegemiteGrrl), Wednesday, 22 August 2012 02:35 (9 months ago) Permalink
VG i wasn't responding to you fwiw, more nathalie and Hurting. every unhappy family is its own special snowflake; i'm not saying people aren't right to pick up on destructive dating patterns in their friends' lives or whatever, just that "it's a shame because he's a really good father" doesn't have much traction from my pov--he's still going to be in his kid's life. it's going to be better for his kid not to have miserable parents being miserable around him when he gets older.
― horseshoe, Wednesday, 22 August 2012 02:36 (9 months ago) Permalink
Oh no I get that it wasn't aimed at me. Just weighing in longwindededly as per usual :)
― set the controls for the heart of the sun (VegemiteGrrl), Wednesday, 22 August 2012 02:38 (9 months ago) Permalink