Mystery Science Theater 3000: C/D, S/D.

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I brought the subject up because I think it's high time we discussed it at length. A lot of Americans on ILx are pretty vocal about their MST3K-love, but for obvious reasons, much of the UK posse have never even seen the show. Those who have only know the Sci-Fi era shows (and can't get Rhino tapes, either), so they're only getting part of the fun.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a Comedy-Central purist at all. The primary reason I got slowly peeved at the AOL NY MST3K contingent was because they were by and large vehemently Anti-Mike, going on and on about how the show was a bunch of boring crap now and how cute and sexy Joel was. I just couldn't see it. Admittedly, though, by the time MST3K left CC, the show's early, woozy charm had long faded away -- but it was replaced by something else that, while slick, was still awfully entertaining. (Charm isn't everything.) At the other end of the history spectrum, the KTMAs aren't bad at all, but all woozy charm and few laffs. Still, that won't matter if you're already a fan.

The worst movie they ever did was, easily, Monster A Go-Go. Scroungily overamped "What'd I Say"-rip at the beginning, but looooong stretches of black & white nothingness punctuated by perhaps the most infuriating cinematic anticlimax ever. Next in line is Manos: The Hands of Fate. It's my impression that MST3K almost single-handedly velcroed this flick onto the Canon of Bad Movies, and that's a good thing, because it's a startling artifact with a great story behind it.

Favorite Sci-Fi-era Episode: Jack Frost. Indeed, every episode involving a children's movie is sterling.

Best Acting in a MST3K Episode: Beverly Garland reads the riot act to The Celery From Outer Space in It Conquered The World. Bela Lugosi tells a fellow scientist off in Bride of the Monster.

Crow vs. Crow: Trace-Crow is more neurotic, Bill-Crow is more snide, yet once Bill got in the groove, I seriously think they were in equal in goodness.

Joel vs. Mike:

Extraneous thought: if in some alternative universe Catalina Caper was a good, no, GREAT movie, the Avalanches' album would be its soundtrack. Perhaps we could kindly suggest to Tim Burton a remake...

Michael Daddino, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

it's a startling artifact with a great story behind it.

I was going to throw in a link to the article with all the info, but dammit, it's expired! Your vision of a new Catalina Caper thrills and disturbs my soul.

Ned Raggett, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Although I should at least throw in a link to the more or less official fan site, the Satellite News.

Ned Raggett, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

The Manos article is here.

Michael Daddino, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

That's one of the reasons I could never get into any of the MST3K fan discussions/forums online, they all seem to suffer from this irrational hatred of Mike. It's so silly and pedantic. What's so wrong with liking Joel and Mike?

Nicole, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Why do you say the movie should not have been made, Mike?

Josh, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

For one, the movie didn't make any money, partly because Gramercy concentrated its promotional efforts on the Pamela Anderson vehicle Barb-Wire, which ended up belly-flopping anyway. Plus, I got this impression from some recent interview with a member of Best Brains (can't remember where I saw this) that they all ended up regretting ever making the thing in the first place. The whole process was too arduous and distracting and they had to deal with all the asshole suits who prided themselves on having a certain level of hepness, yet told BB to take out a joke about Bootsy Collins because they didn't know who was.

Michael Daddino, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

The other weird indulgence of the AOL MSTies was the tongue-lashing Sampo, a.k.a. Chris Cornell (the mst3kinfo.com guy, not the Soundgarden guy), recieved on a regular basis. People seemed real irritated at the fact that he assumed the role of King of All MSTies rather quickly, and I attribute that to minor professional jealousy and peevishness over his pro-Mike stance, all caught in a spiral of ever-amplifying regicidal loathing that you often see online. (Sampo's sometime pomposity didn't help either.) Pettiness a go-go.

Michael Daddino, Sunday, 13 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

dude, fuck all that. after joel left the show totally went to shit. joel really wanted to create a feeling with story /characters and consistancy. mike was just a hired writer. i think i read someone saying in another thread "after a while if felt like the ones running the show just didnt get 'it' "

chaki, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

As so many of us are such pynchon junkies, here's a great mst3k & pynchon link.

i is brit and loving the mst3k. it can grate if you're not in the right mood, but fuck that for a game of toy soldiers. I also liked the film (riffing on This Island Earth -- fave bit is when the alien is explaining about the fate of his planet "a-huh, yeah, yup... got ya... a-huh"

Alan Trewartha, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

In point of fact, Mike wasn't merely a "hired writer": as early as the second season, he was the Head Writer. Since MST3K was always a group effort, I think it's difficult to pinpoint one person who was responsible for any particular characteristic of the show. (Two obvious exceptions, of course, are the whole Gizmonics Institute business and the idea for the Invention Exchange.) So he may share some responsibility with Joel H. for creating the rather paternal relationship between Joel R. & the 'bots -- a relationship which, for obvious reasons, would be altered once Mike replaced Joel R. the SOL.

Michael Daddino, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

The funniest episode of MST3K I've ever seen is a Gammora movie that we watched on KTMA backstage during a high school show choir competition. I can't remember the name of the movie, but the bad monster was a giant gumball machine and the episode contained one of my favorite riffs ever (7-YEAR-OLD GIRL: I love you, Gamora! CROW: Keep your shirt on, honey.). Most of the others I've seen have come from the Sci-Fi years, but "Manos" is definitely classic. I will also put in a vote for "Overdrawn At The Memory Bank" if only because it's fun to watch Raul Julia in something embarrassing, plus "Squirm" and "The Final Sacrifice".

Dan Perry, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

I loved Overdrawn At The Memory Bank as a child. I believe I still have a video on it somewhere doubling up with Max Headroom.

Pete, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Ah, the AOL MSTie days. Got my first stalker out of that bunch.

Anyway, I adored the show. Was a staunch Mike defender in the Mike v. Joel days, now I'm not so sure. Favorite bit (of all time): "Are You Happy In Your Work?"

Colin Meeder, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

What the fuck are you doing here, Colin? :)

Michael Daddino, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Dan -- you saw a KTMA on the air? I envy and worship you, my liege.

Colin -- yeah, I remember you were torgotback@aol.com, but the stalking? No, not that.

The boards also attracted a number of true mental cases, most unforgettably KeijiKJ. He was similar to Gondola Blob in that he indulged in casebook net.kook behavior: delusions of professionalism, snottily dismissive of any random thing, threw around the word "clique" a lot. I've even heard stories that he scared the bejesus out of BB members during the first con. I personally had a thoroughly pointless argument with him about the population of the cities in California.

Concerning Mike, I'll say this: there are quite a few times during the Sci-Fi-era when he seemed to be sending out his performance via Fed Ex. Sad, because it was clear after CC he was capable of much better. But you know, a lot of the Sci-Fi-era episodes that initially seemed kinda minor and kinda eh to me now strike me as being thoroughly solid.

Michael Daddino, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

That was my first exposure to MST3K. I had no idea that it was going to become so huge; I only thought that snarky Minnesotans would find it funny!

Dan Perry, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Well, you're lucky and we hate you. There. ;-)

I'm waiting on Mike's next collection of essays and novel myself. The Megacheese collection was a scream.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Michael: With you and Dave R. here, it was simply a matter of time.

Stalking resulted from an unfortunate IRL encounter with a nice enough person. I thought it was a lovely afternoon, she thought it was TRUE LOVE FOREVER. Eek. The story resolved harmlessly enough -- she found TRUE LOVE FOREVER again with another MSTie, and this time it was returned.

Colin Meeder, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

What the hell do I have to do with anything, Mr. Meeder? I've never seen you before in my life! (Weren't you supposed to get me a job?)

MST3K was never that big a part of my life - I watched it sporadically, and I always seemed to be in the wrong state of mind to truly enjoy it. I'll side with the Joel phreex, though, just because bald is sexy. (I'm getting sexier by the minute.)

David Raposa, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

DR: I'll side with the Joel phreex, though, just because bald is sexy. (I'm getting sexier by the minute.)

But wasn't Mike balder than Joel? I'm confused. No matter. I'm balder than both, and I agree with David.

Brian MacDonald, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

I'm watching Rocketship X-M right now and it looks as if Joel is balder than Mike. I agree wholeheartedly that BALD(ING) = SEXXXY (my real and imaginary boyfriends are testament to this) but Joel really isn't bald enough to be sexy-bald.

Michael Daddino, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

grr, watch it daddino.

ethan, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Le huh?

Michael Daddino, Monday, 14 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Let me second Ned's Mike Nelson's Movie Megacheese rec. Even if you don't like or are not familiar with MST3K it is an extrodinarily funny take on a lot of overblown movies of the 80s and 90s.

Nicole, Tuesday, 15 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Had you gotten that job I mentioned, David, you'd have been laid off about five months ago. So I did you a favor by being a hopeless slacker.

I think that my slight preference for Joel has something to do with a sense that the guy's a bit . . . off, where Mike is merely charming and funny.

Colin Meeder, Tuesday, 15 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Merely? I wouldn't go that far, though he certainly projects more immediate affability. But every so often he comes out with something or takes on a role that makes you a bit nervous. Thus, when he wigged out about his old temp job in one episode, and in Time Chasers where he played his drunk angry brother or cousin, I forget which. Sure, it's a role, but he inhabited them rather well. ;-)

Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 15 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Sampo once remarked that in interview, one can sense that there's something very dark and private about Mike just percolating below the surface, and that's colored my impression of him ever since. One thing to remember: "I suffer from excruciating headaches that dozens of neurologists have tried unsuccessfully to treat. I think I might be possessed."

Michael Daddino, Tuesday, 15 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

I appreciate the fact that both Mike and Bridget are very private about their home life, but from the sound of it from some of Bridget's comments it's a very happy family, lots of singing and nuttiness and fun with their kids. A good reminder that the show was, after all, just a performance.

But yes, Mike has the angst in there somewhere. He just tempers it very beautifully -- thus his legendary turn as Morrissey.

Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 15 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

Fair enough -- Mike probably *is* a churning cauldren of angst. But I think he (and his rage) are probrably more based in reality, where Joel strikes me as more otherworldly. Which I prefer (slightly, only ever so slightly) in humor.

Colin Meeder, Thursday, 17 January 2002 01:00 (12 years ago) Permalink

1 year passes...
Oh, about time for a revival (thanks in part to a recent link from Mike D.). Actually, there were a number of episodes I didn't have, mostly from the sixth season, but my Seattle trip has given me the chance to dub a lot of those from Brian's collection, yay me. Plus I finally have Daddy-O and Fugitive Alien, that took long enough!

To add to the book recommendations -- Mike N.'s general essay book Mind Over Matters is another fine read (the TV essay alone is some kinda genius, the mock 19th century novel even more so), while I very much liked Kevin Murphy's A Year at the Movies. Chris Piuma mentioned he felt it was fairly Joe Queenan-like and therefore not as distinct as it could be, but I think it was handled very well and worked as both microstudy of the moviegoing experience and general reflection. Certainly any of the ILF/film-going hounds on this board should consider reading/borrowing a copy, at least. Then there's Mike's new novel Death Rat, which I really need to order next month...

And praise to all the other castmembers doing things and the continual rolling out of more DVDs, though apparently Rhino says they've exhausted what they have the rights to right now and are looking into securing more, hopefully...

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 25 May 2003 15:08 (11 years ago) Permalink

...although a quick check of the SatNews link sez there's some sort of further DVD thing coming out later this year, hm! Good thing to know. Also, anyone in Minneapolis can go to a writing workshop taught by Mary Jo Pehl next month, which I think would be great (I'm an unabashed fan of hers but she seems to really grate for a lot of MSTies...).

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 25 May 2003 15:11 (11 years ago) Permalink

is this ever shown in the UK?

mark s (mark s), Sunday, 25 May 2003 15:12 (11 years ago) Permalink

It may still be on the Sci-Fi Channel UK, but your best bet is to go on S0ulS33k and download entire episodes (which are about 700MB a pop, FWIW).

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Sunday, 25 May 2003 15:16 (11 years ago) Permalink

I've never come across it here, Mark - but I have never had the Sci-Fi Channel.

Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Sunday, 25 May 2003 15:21 (11 years ago) Permalink

It was certainly on (late night) on the Sci-Fi channel a couple of years ago.

N. (nickdastoor), Sunday, 25 May 2003 15:24 (11 years ago) Permalink

Michael, I kiss you! I had no idea there were mst3k episodes on soulseek.

Nicole (Nicole), Sunday, 25 May 2003 15:34 (11 years ago) Permalink

Yeah, that sounds great, rah Mike! Nicole, I might be able to help with dubbing too though I still need a second VCR, but also please drop me a line about another possible source...

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 25 May 2003 15:52 (11 years ago) Permalink

FYI, Best Brains Inc. has its own little shop with some non-Rhino treasures. I highly recommend "Mr. B's Lost Shorts" which has the hands-down best short, "Mr. B Natural" - you know, the one with the ridiculously perky, questionably-gendered Neverland shill for Conn brass instruments.

"Bad touch."
"Does this mean I like guys now?"
"I feel ill."
"Spanking time!"

http://www.mst3kinfo.com/satnews/catalog/Basement.htm

Ernest P. (ernestp), Sunday, 25 May 2003 15:58 (11 years ago) Permalink

It is a thing of beauty, that particular short. And chilling horror. Yeah, there are two short comps that are on DVD, but neither contain that gem. It's possible this thing Rhino is promising is some sort of basement-clearing compilation of all the various video oddities that have surfaced from Best Brains -- the second Poopie tape (the first is a DVD bonus with Manos, the scrapbook, more shorts like that, etc. But we'll see, I guess! (My other irrational hope is a full-on special edition of the movie...)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 25 May 2003 16:02 (11 years ago) Permalink

Michael, I kiss you! I had no idea there were mst3k episodes on soulseek.

Keep in mind that the fidelity on these files is sometimes suprisingly good considering the size, and sometimes fairly bad, but even the worst files usually have more than enough detail for a person to get what's going on.

I'm hoping the DVD is a Santa Claus vs. The Martians/Santa Claus double fun pak. It is going to come out late 2003, after all.

Later I may want to say something about MST3K in light of Mark's venting on Zappa, but right now I want to go to Central Park and maybe the Malevich exhibit before it starts raining (again).

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Sunday, 25 May 2003 16:33 (11 years ago) Permalink

I SERIOUSLY NEED TO BUY SIDEHACKERS. I HAVE NOT SEEN IT SINCE HIGH SCHOOL

goooch....goooch....

Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 25 May 2003 19:29 (11 years ago) Permalink

the tuba is like a fat jolly king! knew your father I did!

This show got me through middle school.

Anthony Miccio (Anthony Miccio), Sunday, 25 May 2003 19:31 (11 years ago) Permalink

Live fast, die young, leave a fat, bloated, ugly corpse.

luna (luna.c), Sunday, 25 May 2003 19:38 (11 years ago) Permalink

"That squares my breasts!"

Nate Patrin (Nate Patrin), Sunday, 25 May 2003 20:40 (11 years ago) Permalink

I've only seen about four episodes of MST3K, but "Mr. B Natural" has got to be one of the funniest shorts ever! "We're white, we're white, we're really, really white..." I obv need to get a-downloadin on this show.

Vinnie (vprabhu), Sunday, 25 May 2003 23:19 (11 years ago) Permalink

It is good to see the newer folks here who have the love. :-)

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 26 May 2003 00:08 (11 years ago) Permalink

I've only seen a couple but I didn't get the point. Why not just rent the original B-movies and come up with your own sarcastic comments?

sundar subramanian (sundar), Monday, 26 May 2003 00:32 (11 years ago) Permalink

Well...that is the point, kinda. The AOL MSTies used to monkey-pile together in a chat room, and riff like mad to cable TV movies or rented VHS tapes. I remember Congo and A Star Is Born being particularly good for that.

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Monday, 26 May 2003 00:48 (11 years ago) Permalink

I have no TV. I have no VCR. But I do have about 40 tapes of MST3K, well over 100 episodes, mostly Seasons 2-7, with a few 1s and KTMAs.

Chris P (Chris P), Monday, 26 May 2003 00:52 (11 years ago) Permalink

Yeah, I'd say nearly everything from season 5.5 and 6 stands up with the best the show ever achieved.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Monday, 28 July 2014 20:05 (1 month ago) Permalink

And I say that as a still die-hard Joel stan.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Monday, 28 July 2014 20:06 (1 month ago) Permalink

Yeah I wonder if a lot of the latter day hate is less predicated on the Joel/Mike split in the end than it is Trace/Bill.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 28 July 2014 20:16 (1 month ago) Permalink

Trace/Bill is what keeps me from exploring the last few seasons - it's just jarring - but Mike hate stems from immediate post-Joel reactions on Usenet etc. I love the 5-7 Mike episodes now, and it's been kinda great to get to discover them. We're working on Sword and the Dragon which has my new favorite OTM riff from Mike himself: "This legend could have used some punching up." Also: the Coleman Francis trilogy, Zombie Nightmare, Incredible Melting Man, Escape 2000... just amazing. The only thing I really miss is the invention exchanges - without them, the effort to come up with that many good host segments starts to show. There are still some great ones, they're just spread a little thinner.

Doctor Casino, Monday, 28 July 2014 21:00 (1 month ago) Permalink

i'm far less inclined to watch the mike hosting bits than the joel ones, but the movies themselves remain top quality through the syfy years imo

gotta check if i still have my vhs dub of Squirm/Case Of Spring Fever

da croupier, Monday, 28 July 2014 21:05 (1 month ago) Permalink

http://www.soundboard.com/sb/coily_sound_bytes

da croupier, Monday, 28 July 2014 21:09 (1 month ago) Permalink

NO SPRIIINGS

SEEMS TO ME (VegemiteGrrl), Monday, 28 July 2014 21:54 (1 month ago) Permalink

fkn hate that guy

SEEMS TO ME (VegemiteGrrl), Monday, 28 July 2014 21:55 (1 month ago) Permalink

"You'll be the first to die!"

Ned Raggett, Monday, 28 July 2014 22:08 (1 month ago) Permalink

I keep being surprised at how many 2nd half season 5/season 6 episodes have yet to get the proper release treatment. Girls Town is so giddily great -- Mamie Van Doren, Paul Anka, Mel Torme, Elinor Donohue, the Platters, general insanity!

Ned Raggett, Monday, 28 July 2014 22:10 (1 month ago) Permalink

We tried to watch Girls Town and were really really turned off by the attempted rape that opens the movie. My girlfriend ended up writing a post about it on an MST3k Facebook group that she frequents - got a pretty mixed reaction. She wasn't condemning the Brains, just questioning their judgment, and/or looking for a somewhat stronger reaction from Mike and the Bots, like they sometimes give to indicate they're really condemning a choice by the filmmakers, not just mocking the badness with which it was made. Anyway, we ditched it for, I think, Rocketship X-M in the end.

Doctor Casino, Monday, 28 July 2014 22:56 (1 month ago) Permalink

Yes, but ... at no point in the movie is Chip's death really taken as any sort of major tragedy or miscarriage of fate/justice. The happy ending comes when both sisters are scot free and Mel Torme gets roughed up by some nuns.

Not invalidating anyone's take; just wondering if there aren't better targets.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Monday, 28 July 2014 23:04 (1 month ago) Permalink

Usually they're very attuned to icky subtexts, "ew"-ing their way through the pervasive misogyny of The Brain That Wouldn't Die, for instance.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Monday, 28 July 2014 23:06 (1 month ago) Permalink

It was kind of a triggering thing, I dunno. It kinda happens and they just sort of riff on like usual. For me, I'd have appreciated something in the vein of what they do in other scenes, a chorus of "Boos," some "Nobody wants to see this," I dunno. My girlfriend I think really would have just rather they picked a different movie. For both of us it was also a reminder that this episode was made twenty years ago - as long as the time between the early MST3k seasons and some of the movies they riffed!

Doctor Casino, Monday, 28 July 2014 23:17 (1 month ago) Permalink

Ehh, I shouldn't have said "triggering." Just super uncomfortable, touching on very bad memories, etc. But it could be for someone else, I think.

Doctor Casino, Monday, 28 July 2014 23:36 (1 month ago) Permalink

Right, the episode was 20 years ago, and the movie was 60 years ago.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Tuesday, 29 July 2014 01:24 (1 month ago) Permalink

Right......... just saying that the reaction from M&tB is dated in its own way. Like, I would expect literate, sharp, savvy comics in 2014 to 'catch' this scene in a different way today. Even in 1994 it would have been nice, and not out of character based on other episodes of the show where they do call this kind of thing out and make clear that they don't see it as of the same zinging order as "oh isn't this badly plotted" or "oh isn't this quaint."

Doctor Casino, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 02:09 (1 month ago) Permalink

I fully admit to having no real memory of that sequence. The version I had taped off of cable lopped off the first 20 minutes or so, and I never did see the rest until much later.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Tuesday, 29 July 2014 02:16 (1 month ago) Permalink

IIRC they aren't just simply GOOFING during that bit -- there are definitely a few grumbles from Tom and cheering Elinor's character on and all. That said, it's a good take that I'd never thought of before. (Reminds me of a viewing back in 1993/94 where a bunch of us were watching Eegah!.)

Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 02:22 (1 month ago) Permalink

just re-watched the scene (which is longer than i remembered at a minute and a half). the jokes are pretty glib ("oh that kennedy compound," "a weasel ripped my dress -RZZZZ!"), but when the guy falls mike notes "oh look, a moral" - they're pretty glib about the dude's death too. i totally get the scene being a real sour note for the viewer based on their own experiences, but the sequence is pretty OTT in the first place and while they could have underlined a "that is not cool!" stance the way they'd tend to for scenes involving slapping, it'd be a stretch to suggest they leave open the possibility they DO think it's cool.

da croupier, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 02:40 (1 month ago) Permalink

there's also a "hit him harder!"

da croupier, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 02:41 (1 month ago) Permalink

if the scene didn't quickly move from "dude ripping dress" to "dude falling down ravine" - if it seemed like the director was actually trying to titillate - i bet they would have spoken up

da croupier, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 02:44 (1 month ago) Permalink

in a more earnest manner, i mean.

da croupier, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 02:45 (1 month ago) Permalink

Just watched it again too and, agreed on basically all counts. Contrast with their genuine anger when what's her name gets killed in the final reel of The Girl in Lovers Lane.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:02 (1 month ago) Permalink

All fair posts above. I definitely didn't think the Brains thought the sequence was cool. Maybe it just seemed wide open for a point to be made (through humor or otherwise) that there was something pretty fucked up about the (male) makers of a Wild Good Time Teen Movie thinking this scene was the best way to get the plot rolling. Complete with the people who seem to be the protagonists (? I could be wrong?) just not paying any attention to the screams because they're making out in the car! Ha ha ha! I mean at best it's super super tone deaf, and that should be rife for the MST team's skills to point up in a way that....ehhh, I'm beating a dead horse here, it just bugged us, but y'know, there's plenty other episodes to watch.

Doctor Casino, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:15 (1 month ago) Permalink

Actually it's the main villain (Mel Torme, admittedly, but still) who does nothing even after hearing screams.

One possible reason why the jokes don't take a back seat to indignation is perhaps because it's the first minute of the film. Short of walking out en masse, I'm not sure what they could've done. That's right when Mike and the 'bots have to establish their riffs.

Zero-sum argument, tho.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:22 (1 month ago) Permalink

i definitely think if it was done today they'd be more apt to call out the threat of assault as a plot device, even if the would-be rapist was going to be a puddle a minute later

da croupier, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:25 (1 month ago) Permalink

Or they might have just cut the scene entirely, as they've done with any number of other movies.

Now I'm sort of curious to know what the response was on the MST3k Facebook group. If there's one unintended side-effect of the MST3K mindset that still gives me (minuscule) pause every now and again, it's the total alienation from all contexts that aren't based in postmodernist larffs.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:27 (1 month ago) Permalink

oh man considering my own apparent defensiveness, i can't even imagine what degree of "how DARE you suggest they had any responsibility to acknowledge the audience's potential reaction to sexual violence" facebook would offer

da croupier, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:30 (1 month ago) Permalink

"And now let's watch Willa Cather doing her Baby Snooks impression."

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:34 (1 month ago) Permalink

you know, this was a great series, and i never wanted to watch it for 20 years, so i haven't.

son of a lewd monk (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:41 (1 month ago) Permalink

Uh...yay? (I mean considering the amount of baseball specific references throughout the series, I figure you would enjoy that!)

Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:44 (1 month ago) Permalink

you know, this was a great series

100 percent true. Very much agreed. A fantastic and enduring classic TV show. So glad we could share this moment together.

You are exactly why people root for the apes (Eric H.), Tuesday, 29 July 2014 03:52 (1 month ago) Permalink

The reaction was mostly defensive as y'all have guessed, plus some people suggesting other ones to avoid (e.g. Sidehackers) and sharing the trivia that up until Sidehackers they supposedly did not have a policy of watching the whole movie before deciding to use it for the show. That sorta confused me and made me wonder: how exactly did their rights agreements work? Were they obligated to run a movie they'd agreed to, or were they just on too tight a budget to drop a movie they'd paid for? Did they come as package deals?

Doctor Casino, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 04:31 (1 month ago) Permalink

The various things I've seen, via the original episode guide and other posts, was that they could pick individual films but that sometimes there were package deals. Start of season 8 is a good example -- they were plowing their way through a lot of old B/W Universal films that the SciFi Channel had rights to.

Ned Raggett, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 04:34 (1 month ago) Permalink

That makes sense. I remember in one of the interviews or something, they talk about taking package deals from distributors, who relied on desirable movies to force airers to pay fees for awful B-crap in their archives; for the Brains it was the other way around. Or something like that? But it would surprise me if they were obliged to run all the films in the package. Surely the distributor wouldn't care, so long as they were paid for.

On a lighter note, not sure if this has been posted, but: http://io9.com/wheres-servo-is-the-greatest-mst3k-poster-of-all-ti-1561516889 Hours of fun!

Doctor Casino, Tuesday, 29 July 2014 15:46 (1 month ago) Permalink

3 weeks pass...

Not really fair that the 'bots don't get to riff the hell out of those lyrics.

It's Autumn Sunrise (Eric H.), Wednesday, 20 August 2014 02:36 (1 month ago) Permalink

This is true.

Ned Raggett, Wednesday, 20 August 2014 02:42 (1 month ago) Permalink


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