Holding Doors Open for Women

That first sentence is a mess but you understand? In the event that someone is a bit behind you and you have to wait to hold the door for them, I'm more like to hold it/will wait longer for a woman than a man, because women are smaller in general and more likely to wear heels and will have more trouble wrestling a giant old glass and metal door in the wind, or when the granite paving is slippery.

I rather fancy the idea of an ostentatiously gallant and well-mannered lady. It would scare the hell out of a certain kind of neanderthal.

Yeah, but Laurel, she's going to have tog et through it somehow, right? If she's done so on her own, why not see if there's someone on crutches or w/ a baby carriage or whatnot behind her?

how far ahead is too far ahead to hold it open? i always feel bad when i stop to hold the door for someone and they run up to the door so i don't have to wait too long for them, although it just shows that they're polite.

Shh!, that is a weird dilemma that you described upthread. I've come to the conclusion after finding myself oftentimes in similar situations (hallway in my building is extremely narrow and breeds situations like this anytime more than one party is involved in entering or exiting) that it can't be helped that on occasion attempted acts of courtesy are inevitably gonna result in awkwardness and clumsy fumbling, one's best attempts at gracefulness notwithstanding

Also sometimes I find myself maybe giving the appearance of being rude b/c I don't feel like gong through elaborate ritual of performing a favor that, practically speaking, the other able-bodied person in the equation doesn't actually need help with-- so for example, I won't pause the extra few beats in order to hold the door open for someone. Whatever, I'm sure they'll get over it somehow...

i think there is a whole etiquette thing with men and doors that women don't worry about. the waiting thing, the letting a whole group of people thru a door like you are a doorman. or doorperson, sorry. i do all these things and i can't remember anyone telling me i should.

http://991.com/newGallery/The-Hobbits-Men-And-Doors-400167.jpg

how far ahead is too far ahead to hold it open?

For me, if I were to let the door close and it dramtically slammed in their face, that would be too soon. If I'm in a hurry and the person behind me isn't otherwise encumbered or in visible need of a little break, or isn't paying attention (i.e. yammering on their phone), I'll wait a second or two, but not much longer.

xpost - I do those things too scott, even as a lady-person. It's just a small kindness/good manners/watching out for others. Especially when the person behind you is encumbered in some way.

Mr. Jaq otoh was born in a barn/raised by wolves and was never taught to not barrel on through so never looks back and rarely holds the door, even if I'm right behind him.

it's probably worth it for the laughs, though, when other people are around and you can exchange looks with them of "omg, can you believe my spouse is such an ass!"

Yeah, but Laurel, she's going to have tog et through it somehow, right? If she's done so on her own, why not see if there's someone on crutches or w/ a baby carriage or whatnot behind her?

Oh, sorry, I should say: I don't stand aside and hold it like a doorman, but hold it slightly open to give the next person an edge over inertia when they have to re-open it. That's standard, either sex.

There was Sean Micallef skit once about timing in holding doors for people, and it being graded on a curve based on how attractive the person is you're holding the door for as to how far ahead you'll still do it/stand there waiting.

Aha! Here tis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_td1X_c5Gg

Yeah, but Laurel, she's going to have tog et through it somehow, right? If she's done so on her own, why not see if there's someone on crutches or w/ a baby carriage or whatnot behind her?

Oh, sorry, I should say: I don't stand aside and hold it like a doorman, but hold it slightly open to give the next person an edge over inertia when they have to re-open it. That's standard, either sex.

I do what Laurel does for everyone and think it's pretty damn rude when others don't do this tbh.

Something about my town is so crazy, people practically fight over who gets to hold the door for others here. People of all ages & genders are over-eager to hold open doors for one another. Sometimes two or three people will have their hand on the door at the same time. And everyone always says "thanks" to you if you hold the door. It's kind of freaky.

I agree Erica, because otherwise what youre doing is letting a door swing shut behind you into someone's face, and thats just rude! :/

Yeah, exactly. I always check to see if someone is behind me.

xpost to Abbott

re: freaky politeness, today on the train a seat opened up, and there were three of us standing right by it. I figured I'd let one of the other two have it (because I am so valiantly manly) so I backed up to let the other two battle. Instead, they went back and forth gesturing toward the seat - "no, you", "go ahead, it's fine", "please, take it" - then sighing loudly and rolling their eyes at each other! Finally, one of them took the seat, and the other lady covertly gave me this *smh* look that was like "you BELIEVE this shit??"

it's awk at my office--we have a long walkway from the parking garage to the door so oftentimes it is MORE inconvenient to hold the door (because ppl are far away and either they end up awkwardly jogging or you end up awkwardly holding the door for too long). my attitude is that if the door would close in the amount of time it would take a person walking normal pace to walk to it, u shouldn't hold it. but it's hard to judge!

The worst one with seats is the amount of times people offer me their seat. Presumably because they think I'm pregnant ;_;

I now stand on the tram really self conciously holding my stomach in Zapp Branningan-stylee. :/

re: awkward distances- if someone is holding a door open for me, i speed up for them. fuck leaving someone waiting holding a door open for you.

When you hold the door for someone who is just that little bit too far away and make them break into a jog, do you say anything to discourage the jogging? Last couple of times I blurted "don't run!" and then felt bad for sounding like a schoolma'am telling children off instead of the laidback "oh hey, I'm in no hurry" I was aiming for.

xp oh i totally agree but its still awk for all involved

i think giving them speed tips makes it more awk!

uh yeah i don't cheerlead when holding doors myself, but it might be worth a try. HUT HUT HUT I WANNA SEE SOME FUCKING HUSTLE OUT THERE

Ha, well, I hate keeping people waiting and/or feeling pressurised into hurrying up, so I wanted to reassure people that they didn't need to, except it came out all wrong.

Next time I'll keep my mouth shut and worry that my facial expression will be mistaken for irritation at their slowness or wry amusement at their running technique or something instead.

just act oblivious to yr surroundings at all times imo

ie walk into doors without opening them?

So what about the case when somebody holds the door for you and you say "Thank You" but it is not loud or effusive enough for their liking and they give you a politeness lesson: "What do you say? 'Thank You.' Yeah, that's right."

then they're assholes. teaching other adults manners, especially strangers, is just rude!

someone should take them to task tbh

"Dude, I was one foot away and going to open the door myself. You ran over from the other side to open it and score some points. I had already leaned in to open it myself, as I said before, and my momentum just carried me through. By the time I turned around to thank you, you were ready with the manners lesson."

Next time will do full on forehead-to-the-floor Japanese bow.

So what about the case when somebody holds the door for you and you say "Thank You" but it is not loud or effusive enough for their liking and they give you a politeness lesson: "What do you say? 'Thank You.' Yeah, that's right."

This happened to me at my last job and that girl gave me death stares for about a year afterwards. I said fucking thank you! What kind of prick does that anyway? Oh, Maria already said.

written pre-Hollaback. probably belongs on an etiquette thread, if we have one.

http://splicetoday.com/writing/the-nine-sidewalk-commandments

this thread is a trip

i do have a habit of holding doors open for people and yes i do get gender dysphoria over it, because of course i do

conversely yeah i get gender euphoria when a man holds the door open for me

doesn't happen a lot, i don't have a lot of guy friends i can hang out with in person. being on the receiving end of gendered behavior tends to give me gender euphoria. even if it's unpleasant. i still react to it the way anybody else would to the unpleasant behavior - if someone talks over me, i get pissed - but it's also validating. some of us call it "ewww-phoria". i've heard guys talk about getting it when they walk down the street and smile and wave at a woman and she crosses the street.

i think still having euphoria from that kind of thing, years later, is mostly down to me just not being treated in gendered ways - which is a good thing! where i live, mostly people aren't going to assume my pronouns. i literally get treated like a person. i am also fairly oblivious to my surroundings in a visual sense... if someone is looking at me in a certain way i'm unlikely to notice. same goes for proprioception, i just don't know where people are in relation to me. one of the reasons i have a startle reflex when someone touches me unexpectedly. it has to be something obvious, like someone holding a door open for me or something, for me to notice.

i try to hold doors open for people, but i don't like for people to hold the doors open for me. it's a mess of contradictions. my partner is the same way. they're always rushing ahead to open the door for me. when we approach an entrance we both rush to the door to try to hold it open. they always get there first, it seems, and then i often stand aside of the entryway, for some reason, and ask that they please enter the door (that they opened) first. sometimes i even take hold of the door that they have opened and urge them to go ahead and enter the building -- they've done enough, they deserve it. in general, we run toward closed doors, prop them open, then stand to the side for a few seconds while deliberating over what should happen next. sometimes, during those few seconds, other people enter the building from the outside, or exit from inside. it feels great to help people