The Ratpure

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(Yeah, I was talking more about vocal quality than the actual notes he's hitting.)

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 15 May 2003 13:10 (twenty years ago) link

I had the "Races" EP, and liked half of the tracks, then went off them. Then I heard the "old" version of Olio and thought "meh". Then I heard the "new" version of Olio...can't wait for the album. The last song on the aforementioned EP ("Caravan"?) is also great.

Nordicskillz (Nordicskillz), Thursday, 15 May 2003 13:22 (twenty years ago) link

Cheers for the Sister Saviour recommendation Yancey, it's excellent.

Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 15 May 2003 16:13 (twenty years ago) link

Cool, Ronan. It's my fave on there by far.

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 15 May 2003 16:15 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah it's got that swirly club feel to it, I could almost imagine it being played out. I also look forward to seeing who'll do the remixes when they release more singles. I'd love to see Jacques or someone get a hold of Sister Saviour.

Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 15 May 2003 16:46 (twenty years ago) link

sister saviour = "jeopardy" by the greg kihn band

mosurock (mosurock), Thursday, 15 May 2003 16:50 (twenty years ago) link

The new record's OK. I like the old "Olio" better tho.

Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Thursday, 15 May 2003 17:26 (twenty years ago) link

Some of this is a bit Pixies, anyone agree?

Yes, track 2. Some of it's a bit Minutemen, too.

scott m (mcd), Thursday, 15 May 2003 17:46 (twenty years ago) link

the best part is that i have a feeling their best record is still to come.

jess (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 15 May 2003 17:49 (twenty years ago) link

That's so very true, jess. And I don't have that feeling very often. It's a good feeling.

scott m (mcd), Thursday, 15 May 2003 17:51 (twenty years ago) link

i keep wondering how much of this is murphy and goldworthy. it's pretty well-known that the rapture and dfa spent a lot of time on this record, and jim & tim spent a lot of time trying to convince the rapture to go in more of a dance direction. obviously their prodding worked. live they are still much closer to out of the races (which i loved then and i love now, h8rs step off!) than "hojl," so i think there might be two bands at work here -- the rapture (sorry, ratpure) studio act, which combines dance and rock convincingly, stressing each equally, and the rapture the live act, which doesn't stray too far from the gang of four template.

i would not be surprised, actually, if they never make another record. since they hooked up with dfa almost two years ago they've really been sheltered and coddled by jim & tim -- tons of studio time, lots of off days, etc. -- and once echoes drops (sometime in 2k7, at this rate) they'll be in a spotlight that they've managed to court yet avoid at the same time. i dunno if they'll be able to handle it. i hope they can, though. they're sweet guys and an amazing band...

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 15 May 2003 17:54 (twenty years ago) link

another point: a friend proposed that the dfa is courting this early factory records vibe in that they're trying to stay out of the limelight but at the same time trying to bring the attention to themselves without looking like they want it. standard-issue p.r. for sure. he suggested that once the rapture, juan maclean and lcd soundsystem records drop (a couple of which perhaps on a major label, say some who are in the know) the dfa will no longer be able to maintain this air of mystery and they'll become just another pair of studio heads and the dfa as we know it will die.

i dunno if i believe that, but it's interesting to think about. that once the dfa becomes THE DFA they'll effectively cease to exist. i dunno.

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:00 (twenty years ago) link

has anyone heard lcd soundsystem besides "give it up" and "losing my edge"?

They're not too far away from exploding are they? It certanly isn't a scene that will stay in any one incarnation for very long.

Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:02 (twenty years ago) link

i was talking to matos about what the reception to the rapture will be once echoes drops, and i maintain that the glossy reviews will not be great, just cuz they generally aren't friendly to dance music, just like the mainstream u.s. scene isn't. for the rapture i think it'll be a big in nyc, la and europe situation. elsewhere they won't do shit.

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:05 (twenty years ago) link

Jockey Slut and Muzik over here are creaming themselves non stop about all the DFA stuff, partly because they're dying to promote a big new trend for dance music I suppose which might be irritating except that in fairness they're not going about it in the annoying "this is the new dance music" way which less informed stuff inevitably will once it breaks big.

But they are doing the whole creating terms like "disco pogo" and using "punkfunk" on every page almost in an effort to make it seem a huge event. I think they're anxious to be more up to speed with this than they were with electroclash.

Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:10 (twenty years ago) link

...the dfa will no longer be able to maintain this air of mystery and they'll become just another pair of studio heads and the dfa as we know it will die.

I think that depends wholly on the quality and fabric of the records they decide to drop, but it's an interesting thought.

scott m (mcd), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:11 (twenty years ago) link

Anthony Wilson had this great quote at the SXSW talk about how not seeking publicity was fantastic until the novelty wore off (circa about 1981-82 or so). It'd prolly be reasonable to assume that DFA is gonna hit the same sort of wall, but hey, they can deal with it when it happens.

I was pretty impressed by how well the Ratpure pulled off the sound of the record when they played live. Obviously, I can see why jim & tim love working with them... they seem pretty malleable, and I don't mean that in a bad sort of way.

The guy at the merch table said late summer for a release date, btw, and even that sounded kind of tentative. I do wonder what the delay is? Seems like it'd be a perfect summer record. Is their international distribution REALLY that hard to sort out?

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:16 (twenty years ago) link

There are deals afoot, Aaron. The date's gone from late May to June to now August, from what I've heard. But yeah, some majors are not only courting the Rapture but the DFA as a whole, which would obviously be tough. It's hard to see how the DFA's current inconspicuous approach would mesh with the demands of the likes of Iovine, Davis, etc.

And yeah, the Rapture does seem malleable in a good way. We need more bands who don't respect their own sound and style as much as they should (see my Calla thread).

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:21 (twenty years ago) link

the unwritten law against releasing indie rock records while school's out must be remembered also

James Blount (James Blount), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:22 (twenty years ago) link

Isn't Trevor Jackson just dying to release all this stuff on Output in the UK and get the kudos though?

Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:24 (twenty years ago) link

very true blount. as odd as it sounds, cmj still matters in some worlds!

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:27 (twenty years ago) link

Weird that they'd want to go that route, Yanc3y. Bet they must be getting some phat deals coming their way though.

The thing that worries me... if Alan McGee taught us anything, it's that once you make your deal with the major, you're gonna sell loads more records but it's basically all over.

Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:30 (twenty years ago) link

It's sort of what Roc-a-fella and No Limit did, brought their own marketing/pr methods to daddy major.

scott m (mcd), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:43 (twenty years ago) link

i love Musik

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 15 May 2003 18:51 (twenty years ago) link

I just checked this thread and apparently nobody has mentioned it, so I will...to my surprise, because I'm shocked nobody has mentioned Thom Yorke as a vocal influence/touchstone here. "Open Up Your Heart" may indeed have the whole Bowie "Five Years" thing going but vocally it reminds me of nothing so much as a variant of "Karma Police"/"Rabbit In Your Headlights"...

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 16 May 2003 00:49 (twenty years ago) link

Rapture backlash begins... now!

slutsky (slutsky), Friday, 16 May 2003 01:10 (twenty years ago) link

(And "Infatuation" as well...though that one's got enough Cure-circa-The Top all over it to make poor Dan die of delight if he hasn't already. ;-))

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 16 May 2003 01:20 (twenty years ago) link

can't believe no one's mentioned Screamadelica (well, one guy did but it wasn't in the same way) as a point of reference for this album--it's basically an American version of that album only actually really good beyond a couple of tracks. then again, I don't hear it being the full-on masterwork a lot of you guys do, though I do enjoy it a lot.

M Matos (M Matos), Friday, 16 May 2003 02:30 (twenty years ago) link

He sounds like Buckley (J) to me on Open Up Your Heart.

Ferg (Ferg), Friday, 16 May 2003 02:35 (twenty years ago) link

Frightening thought, Freg. I'll stick with Thom. ;-)

Screamadelica? I dunno, that doesn't actually strike me as a point of comparison...could you spell that out a bit more, M.? I can't put my finger on why that wouldn't be something I'd suggest, so I'd want to know more about why you do.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 16 May 2003 02:39 (twenty years ago) link

No I don't see the Screamadelica thing either really, and I don't mind Screamadelica.

I have a third person I think he sounds like on Open Up Your Heart, WILL OLDHAM!

Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 16 May 2003 07:29 (twenty years ago) link

I agree with the Thom York influence on "Open Up Your Heart". And "Heaven" does too remind me of The Pixies circa Surfer Rosa.
He remineds me of Tom Velraine mostly and on the track "Echoes" he sounds like Tom Velraine trieng to imitate John Lydon.

rexJr., Friday, 16 May 2003 10:42 (twenty years ago) link

Apparantly, the Rapture will be signed to either EMI or Universal by the end of next week. Echoes is due around September, and they might yet monkey around with the tracklisting. So don't go making any hasty judgements yet.

Jason J, Friday, 16 May 2003 13:47 (twenty years ago) link

those fuckers! maybe it'll get some promotional muscle behind it at least

James Blount (James Blount), Friday, 16 May 2003 13:48 (twenty years ago) link

It's Universal

NoOne (ystrickler), Friday, 16 May 2003 13:52 (twenty years ago) link

Not exactly a new development. A major-label deal's been in the works for over a year... that's why they've had no proper high-profile releases, save for the limited-edition vinyl that came out on Output.

I heard that EMI were still in the running, and this was from somebody who really should know. But I guess we'll find out soon enough.

Jason J, Friday, 16 May 2003 13:56 (twenty years ago) link

Screamadelica comparisons: similar groove-orientation, as Jess noted, that gives the dance/rock crossover a strong grounding; the style-grafting is both very conscious but sounds really natural; "I Need Your Love" seems like the ideal of what Primal Scream were aiming for, indie vox/gtr + dirty house groove, I love it; "Open Up Your Heart" reminds me of "Movin' on Up" drained of euphoria (which is why it's a NOW Screamadelica rather than a '91 one); "HOJL" = "Loaded," the brill fusion "we" didn't quite know we were waiting for but knew immediately upon contact "we" had been.

obv a some of this is fairly tenuous but the mood of the record strikes me as very similar to what PS were aiming for. I like about four or five songs on the PS album a lot but it seems to lose direction a lot, and this doesn't.

M Matos (M Matos), Friday, 16 May 2003 14:58 (twenty years ago) link

(haha typo negative! no, wait, typo positive because I made so goddamned many!)

M Matos (M Matos), Friday, 16 May 2003 14:59 (twenty years ago) link

Mmm...I'm listening to it again now, M., and I'm terribly intrigued by your comparisons but I really can't hear them. They don't sound like, for lack of a better word, natural connections between the songs you describe (and to be fair you say it's tenuous and all). Ultimately I disagree with you in terms of mood. Screamadelica struck me a big messy party with lots of happy drugs but also (whisper it) a greater range and absolutely no angst at all, which I think is crucial. There's no connection between Bobby Gillespie's stoned and zoned celebrations and the Ratpure guy's nervous, wound up fear and release, at least that I can sense.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 16 May 2003 15:34 (twenty years ago) link

I didn't mention the "except all tense and angsty" part upthread, did I? fuck, I meant to. ah well.

M Matos (M Matos), Friday, 16 May 2003 15:36 (twenty years ago) link

(and no, I don't actually expect you to believe that. it's true though)

M Matos (M Matos), Friday, 16 May 2003 15:38 (twenty years ago) link

No, maybe you did! Still, yeah, I don't know. The album sounds so much more obsessively structured and 'clean,' for lack of a better word, than Screamadelica. The song that would most leap to mind is "Don't Fight It, Feel It."

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 16 May 2003 15:39 (twenty years ago) link

(Er, maybe you did say that upthread rather than expect me to believe it...or something).

Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 16 May 2003 15:39 (twenty years ago) link

I double checked, and I didn't. not a big deal except I could have made my point a lot clearer--probably one of those things I've said alout so much that I figure it'll just make its way into what I type...without my actually having to type it. (kinda like this fucking book!) but I must say, one thing I'm noticing w/a lot of nu-postpunk that I don't think gets remarked on near enough is how close they are in lots of ways to Madchester/indie-dance, only brittler, w/the E-ffect drained out. the Out Hud album is like that a bit, obviously the Rapture strikes me that way...maybe it's just the rock-dance thing that automatically sets those associations off, but I do hear some of it in there.

M Matos (M Matos), Friday, 16 May 2003 15:44 (twenty years ago) link

(don't forget the new !!! single, matos, which is as great as you said...)

Yanc3y (ystrickler), Friday, 16 May 2003 15:45 (twenty years ago) link

fyi, www.therapturemusic.com - semi weblog by Mattie from the band.

arch Ibog (arch Ibog), Friday, 16 May 2003 15:45 (twenty years ago) link

was gonna mention that too, yeah...

M Matos (M Matos), Friday, 16 May 2003 15:48 (twenty years ago) link

Anyone else think "Love is All" sounds like Big Star circa Radio City?

Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Friday, 16 May 2003 16:30 (twenty years ago) link

man the level of speculation on this thread is reason alone why this record will be huge when it drops. Insane.

hstencil, Friday, 16 May 2003 17:01 (twenty years ago) link

it may be the next:
http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/dre500/e597/e59764jsz2c.jpg

gygax! (gygax!), Friday, 16 May 2003 17:26 (twenty years ago) link


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