Howard Vs. Thome

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Will Ryan Howard, in his second year as a Phillie, beat former Phillie 1st baseman and his predecessor, current White Sock Jim Thome in homeruns this year?

― Heath Raymond (Heath Raymond), Friday, 9 June 2006 01:52 (seventeen years ago) link

Depends on how long it takes the feds to get a search warrant for Thome's house.

― milo z (mlp), Friday, 9 June 2006 02:18 (seventeen years ago) link

the answer is no, but nice try! sp glad Aaron is working out for you , though! We really loved him in Chi (and still do!) I seriously contemplated getting an A-Row jersey at one point.

I'll report back on the answer to this question from the playoffs.

many thanks,
SD

― Stormy Davis (diamond), Friday, 9 June 2006 04:51 (seventeen years ago) link

Are you gonna go see the Tigers play the Yankees har har har

― polyphonic (polyphonic), Friday, 9 June 2006 06:09 (seventeen years ago) link

one month passes...

Thome's annual injury bug just flared up, meanwhile Howard seems to be hitting his stride.

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Thursday, 3 August 2006 19:49 (seventeen years ago) link

one month passes...

Ryan Howard is putting together perhaps the best offensive season in the past 5 years.

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Sunday, 3 September 2006 03:33 (seventeen years ago) link

Eh?? Then perhaps you could tell me what makes Howard's season so much better than Ortiz's (or Hafner's)?

Ortiz

.287 .400 .633 47 HR 121 RBI

Howard

.299 .393 .639 49 HR 128 RBI

Overall Park Factors for Philly vs Boston are similar, but Fenway is least favorable (huh?) for HR's, while Citizen's Bank Park is one of the most favorable.

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Sunday, 3 September 2006 06:09 (seventeen years ago) link

Or Manny's .326/.442/.628

― milo z (mlp), Sunday, 3 September 2006 15:55 (seventeen years ago) link

lol

― gear (gear), Sunday, 3 September 2006 18:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Sorry, excluding Boston area general hospital wards, Ryan Howard is having actually a pretty good season!

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Sunday, 3 September 2006 21:52 (seventeen years ago) link

Ryan Howard has definitely been in a groove. It seems everytime I see Philles highlights for the past ten days or so, he is crushing a pitch out of the yard.

― Earl Nash (earlnash), Monday, 4 September 2006 03:32 (seventeen years ago) link

Pretty good season, absolutely, but I was wondering what you thought was particularly notable about Howard's season (compared to any season by any player over the last five years) when there are five or six guys putting up numbers that are just as good, not to mention Bonds posting a 1400 OPS a couple of years ago.

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Monday, 4 September 2006 06:19 (seventeen years ago) link

Sure, if you take OPS to be the end all offensive stat you're making a case for the rest of those guys... but what about the home run, the run batted in, the clutchiness clutchtacular intangibles... that's what I'm talking about.

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Monday, 4 September 2006 14:46 (seventeen years ago) link

Who are you and what have you done to my shasta?

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Monday, 4 September 2006 15:41 (seventeen years ago) link

i'm just amused by his 6 hr in which he posted a 1.346 slg! it is kind of amazing that this guy's just been crushing minor league pitching for a few years and in his first full ml season he breaks the franchise record for home runs.

oh, ed...

― jonathan quayle higgins (j.q. higgins), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 13:32 (seventeen years ago) link

So say Howard breaks Maris/Ruth's mark, then what?

He is not caucasian which should lead to some immediate media skepticism.

Is America ready for Ryan Howard to be our new, clean face of superheroics?

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 13:38 (seventeen years ago) link

i think it helps that he was a mature rookie and the development that generally accompanies moving from late teens to early and mid 20s more or less occurred out of the public eye. also can't hurt that he is genial, articulate, a family man and amurikan!

he's at 54 now? i'd be surprised if he didn't break 61.

― jonathan quayle higgins (j.q. higgins), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 14:08 (seventeen years ago) link

i think my favorite ryan howard moment this year was at the home run derby, when commentators were warning, "this could do to him what it did to abreu, sap his power completely because he had to alter his swing!!"

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 14:49 (seventeen years ago) link

to be fair to stormy, thome also homered last night, pulling him to within 15 of ry-ho

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 17:01 (seventeen years ago) link

re: park factors

i believe that the difference b/w road and home home runs for howard is minimal.

he has 28 at home so i guess 26 or 27 on the road? admittedly, i don't know what the break down of home and road games is, but still...

― jonathan quayle higgins (j.q. higgins), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 18:18 (seventeen years ago) link

Howard's splits:

Home
71 games
255 AB
48 runs
79 hits
7 2b
1 3b
28 HR
70 RBI
44 BB
75 K
.310 BA
.414 OBP
.675 SLG
1.089 OBPS

Away
64 G
247 AB
41 R
76 H
11 2b
0 3b
25 HR
64 RBI
34 BB
79 K
.308 BA
.392 OBP
.656 SLG
1.047 OBPS

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 18:23 (seventeen years ago) link

to compare, here are papi's:

Home
61 games
229 AB
41 runs
65 hits
13 2b
1 3b
17 HR
60 RBI
46 BB
51 K
.284 BA
.400 OBP
.572 SLG
.972 OBPS

Away
67 games
256 AB
58 runs
74 hits
12 2b
0 3b
30 HR
61 RBI
45 BB
49 K
.289 BA
.400 OBP
.688 SLG
1.088 OBPS

― gear (gear), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 18:25 (seventeen years ago) link

I could not believe Garner walking R.H to lead off the 9th with the score tied yesterday, even after he hit one 475ft earlier.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 18:47 (seventeen years ago) link

Guys, guys, guys:

Manny and Ortiz get it done WHEN IT COUNTS. Does Howard Ryan have a ring? Exactly.

Also: SMALL SAMPLE SIZE!!!! This Howard's a fluke, I doubt if he'll finish with 54, uh, 55 HRs. Only 861 career at-bats?

NEXT.

― Steve O'Shaugnessy (Steve Shasta), Friday, 8 September 2006 16:01 (seventeen years ago) link

I'ma punch the next fuck that talks about Ryan Howard being "clean" and "redeeming" the home run record. Suck one fucking green pill, you know-nothing a-holes. YEAH I'M TALKING TO YOU.

― David R. (popshots75`), Friday, 8 September 2006 16:17 (seventeen years ago) link

I take the blue pill.

― c('°c) (Leee), Friday, 8 September 2006 17:29 (seventeen years ago) link

Howard is out slugging Pujols and Hafner and he trails both ever so slightly in OPS.

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Saturday, 9 September 2006 04:36 (seventeen years ago) link

There's also this, which is worth dusting off:

HR 	Player/Team 	Year
73	Barry Bonds, San Francisco (N.L.) 	2001
70	Mark McGwire, St. Louis (N.L.)	1998
66	Sammy Sosa, Chicago (N.L.)	1998
65	Mark McGwire, St. Louis (N.L.)	1999
64	Sammy Sosa, Chicago (N.L.)	2001
63	Sammy Sosa, Chicago (N.L.)	1999
61 	Roger Maris, New York (A.L.) 	1961
60 	Babe Ruth, New York (A.L.) 	1927
59 	Babe Ruth, New York (A.L.) 	1921
58 	Jimmie Foxx, Philadelphia (A.L.) 	1932
58 	Hank Greenberg, Detroit (A.L.) 	1938
58	Mark McGwire, Oakland (A.L.), St. Louis (N.L.)	1997
57	Luis Gonzalez. Arizona (N.L.)	2001
57	Alex Rodriguez, Texas (A.L.)	2002
56 	Hack Wilson, Chicago (N.L.) 	1930
56	Ken Griffey, Jr., Seattle (A.L.)	1997
56	Ken Griffey, Jr., Seattle (A.L.)	1998
56	Ryan Howard Phiadelphia (N.L.)	2006

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Saturday, 9 September 2006 04:36 (seventeen years ago) link

By player (ie, discounting players with multiple entries), Ryan Howard (w/ 22 games to go) is tied for 10th for single season HRs.

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Saturday, 9 September 2006 04:43 (seventeen years ago) link

you know, looking at that list, it's kind of flabbergasting to be reminded about just how great Greenberg (and, sure, Foxx too) was...

Howard, though, is really something else

― Stormy Davis (diamond), Saturday, 9 September 2006 05:08 (seventeen years ago) link

having seen the phils a bunch of times live in the last couple summers, i cannot express enough how enjoyable it is to watch howard at the plate and just how jazzed the crowd gets by him merely entering the box.

― jonathan quayle higgins (j.q. higgins), Saturday, 9 September 2006 17:27 (seventeen years ago) link

Howard is indeed impressive, but he DOES have a hitter's park at home. Park-adjust!

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Saturday, 9 September 2006 19:59 (seventeen years ago) link

Going by his home-away splits, the fact his home games are in a hitter's park doesn't seem to be making much difference to his performance.

― ojitarian (ojitarian), Saturday, 9 September 2006 20:12 (seventeen years ago) link

(xpost) Hey stat guy, look at the actual hitting chart:

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/mlb/stats/mlb_individual_player_hitting_chart.jsp?playerID=429667&statType=1

Howard has arguably 3-4 "cheap" homeruns at home (down the LF line), I'm sure David Wright or Cliff Floyd or whoever you think is better has about the same amount of cheap homeruns in some other crackerjack box.

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Saturday, 9 September 2006 20:18 (seventeen years ago) link

I can't believe how few doubles he's hit.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Saturday, 9 September 2006 23:34 (seventeen years ago) link

Frank Thomas currently has EIGHT.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Saturday, 9 September 2006 23:35 (seventeen years ago) link

Look at Howard's HR chart at home and compare Thomas' HR chart at home and tell me again how "few" cheap homeruns he has at home. That's if those charts me fuck all as far as accuracy goes. Either way you don't pick and choose the park factors (see: Larry Walker 1997 for example in BBBT#s.) Just because it may not look like Howard is benefitting doesn't mean he isn't.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Saturday, 9 September 2006 23:39 (seventeen years ago) link

Every time I seem to see Howard hit a home run in highlights it goes a half mile. I'm sure you hit 56 a couple are gimmes with the wind or the park, but the dude has also hit some absolute moon shots.

― Earl Nash (earlnash), Sunday, 10 September 2006 00:33 (seventeen years ago) link

Alex can you please parse your entire 5:39pm PST post, way too many triple negatives to get through.

Also, what do Frank Thomas or Larry Walker have to do with anything?

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Sunday, 10 September 2006 00:46 (seventeen years ago) link

Thank you for the informative posts Alex!

― FUCK BABY SURI I HOPE IT CHOKES TO DEATH ON HUBBARD WAFERS (Adrian Langston), Sunday, 10 September 2006 02:43 (seventeen years ago) link

Adrian, please stay on topic.

With Hafner out and Ortiz/Manny vanishing into the Bermuda Triangle:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting?split=0&league=mlb&season=2006&seasonType=2&sort=OPS&type=reg&ageMin=17&ageMax=51&state=0&college=0&country=0&hand=a&pos=all

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Sunday, 10 September 2006 05:31 (seventeen years ago) link

1) Assuming those charts accurately reflect the distance of Howard's home runs, a lot more than a few seem pretty close to just getting over the wall to me.

2) One of the reasons why you adjust for park factors REGARDLESS of whether or not a player's home/away splits "seem" different is that value of a run (or a home run) is DIFFERENT based on where you are playing. If everyone is scoring a lot of runs in Philly then you need to score a lot more runs to win a game there then you do in San Diego where runs are relatively hard to come by.

3) What is that link supposed to reflect, Steve?

4) Haha Adrian why am I banned from I Love Football?

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Sunday, 10 September 2006 14:55 (seventeen years ago) link

lol I have been a grumpy gus lately :( but I am so delighted at this moment by Steve Smith being out for today's game that I have unbanned you.

― FUCK BABY SURI I HOPE IT CHOKES TO DEATH ON HUBBARD WAFERS (Adrian Langston), Sunday, 10 September 2006 15:22 (seventeen years ago) link

Haha I couldn't even remember the last time I posted to ILNFL so I was totally lost as to what I had done to deserve to banning.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Sunday, 10 September 2006 15:30 (seventeen years ago) link

Thanks for the clarification. It would be interesting to get a HR by distance table. I wonder if anyone does that.

My link was supposed to point to a sorted table of OPS. Howard has now surpassed Ortiz, Manny and Pujols and trails Hafner by 0.003. Maybe yahoo 's table is better:

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/stats/bycategory?cat=Batting&conference=MLB&year=season_2006&qualified=1&sort=25

And just a little FYI, Bonds (who does not qualify since he has 437 plate appearances, 2 less than yahoo's qualification of 439 PA's) would fall in #11th place in OPS.

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Sunday, 10 September 2006 15:38 (seventeen years ago) link

Howard has passed Pujols in VORP, but he's behind in EqA and WARP.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Sunday, 10 September 2006 15:48 (seventeen years ago) link

I totally blame this board btw for me EVEN knowing what the hell any of those are.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Sunday, 10 September 2006 15:50 (seventeen years ago) link

hahaha otm

― FUCK BABY SURI I HOPE IT CHOKES TO DEATH ON HUBBARD WAFERS (Adrian Langston), Sunday, 10 September 2006 17:32 (seventeen years ago) link

What about Runs Created? Win Shares? WE MUST FIND OUT!

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Sunday, 10 September 2006 18:53 (seventeen years ago) link

Jeter Factor? Does Howard pump his fist when he gets a hit in the late innings? Quiet leadership is for sissies.

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Sunday, 10 September 2006 19:42 (seventeen years ago) link

[i]2) One of the reasons why you adjust for park factors REGARDLESS of whether or not a player's home/away splits "seem" different is that value of a run (or a home run) is DIFFERENT based on where you are playing.[/i]

Fair enough, that's a good point that I hadn't appreciated before.

― ojitarian (ojitarian), Sunday, 10 September 2006 22:38 (seventeen years ago) link

He's on pace for 5 more = 62.

― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Sunday, 17 September 2006 23:56 (seventeen years ago) link

re-reading through most of this thread, i was just going to calculate that number. thanks for saving me the trouble.

― mr. brojangles (sanskrit), Monday, 18 September 2006 13:26 (seventeen years ago) link

ten years pass...

welp

― nomar, Thursday, 5 January 2017 18:29 (seven years ago) link

Ryan Howard is putting together perhaps the best offensive season in the past 5 years.
― Steve Shasta (Steve Shasta), Saturday, September 2, 2006 11:33 PM (ten years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

― ein Sexmonster (Jimmy The Mod Awaits The Return Of His Beloved), Friday, 6 January 2017 15:17 (seven years ago) link

how quickly shasta forgot barry bonds

― mookieproof, Friday, 6 January 2017 15:39 (seven years ago) link

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