Selling Out

Your chances of a record deal won't have much to do with how you put together your promo package or word your band bio. I mean that stuff might make a small difference, but it's not like there's some magic way to do it that will give you a good shot at a record deal.

A label will sign you because it thinks you will make money and/or because you fit into its vision of itself as a label. The bigger the label, the more they probably care about how much money you could make them. That doesn't mean you have sell your forehead as ad space, it just means a label is going to want to feel that you have a sound that will appeal to a good sized niche of people, and that your band is salable in some way. It won't hurt if your band looks good.

Perhaps even more, they'll care A LOT about how hard you work - how much you're already doing to promote your band and how much you're willing to do. They're going to want to know that you play live often and probably that you're willing to tour a fair amount. They'll probably prefer that you have a good live show, although labels vary on the importance of this.

Of course if you just want to find "a label" there are a zillion little labels out there. But you have to ask if the label is going to do anything you can't do for yourselves. Perhaps it's a credible name in some scene - that can help. Or maybe it's just some slob but he has a fat wad of money from a settlement and he's willing to spend it promoting you - that can help too. But "label" doesn't inherently mean shit.

Sub-pop won't even take unsolicited demos, by the way, so you'd better think smaller.

A lot of bands just use the web now in terms of promo packages.

Also, assuming you aren't a recording-only act of some kind, do you play live at decent clubs? Do you have any draw? Have you gotten on bills with anyone you've heard of? Those might be good things to focus on even as you're sending demos. Those goals are more attainable and can boost your profile, and sometimes bookers at those clubs have label contacts if they like you. Contacts help a lot.

Also read Donald Passman's book on the biz.

Also getting signed can take a really long time even if you're good. So don't just send out demos and wait by the phone, because it doesn't work like that.

Hey, sorry for so many posts, I just drank to much coffee. I happened to check out your myspace page. It sounds good, but my advice to you right now is to hold off on the label stuff. It sounds/looks like you haven't been a band very long and you need to get "seasoned" more before labels will take any interest. Just go out there and play live more, record more, fine-tune your sound and material, maybe get some photos taken, promote your shows well, etc. Try to connect with some bigger local bands, local show promoters/bookers, etc.

Eat your peas. Prepare to suffer for art. Polish your skills at apple-polishing. Become good at logrolling on MySpace. Deduce how to game your video on YouTube.

thanks hurting, yeah, i didnt really think that i could just send out a 4 song cd a and get a fat living stipend or anything; hence the utter naivete of my initial post!! i am trawling for clues now, and dont apologize, for you have been helpful! i guess the real question i'm asking is, should i even be concerned about labels now; my gut reaction was "probably not" and your posts have confirmed that; still, i live in a city where there a zillion unsigned bands who seem content to play basement shows to their friends for years, and i'm thinking, i don't want to do that, i'd rather be a soulless capitalist, i want to get on the track of maybe something a little more serious. thanks again, and thanks for listening to my page. task number one is rewrite all the bullshit my bandmate put up there initially

one of my friends was in a band that was really going for pop success, more than any other band i've known personally (as opposed to a more underground/indie level of success). they did it by writing songs that college girls love, going to college towns the day before their gigs and playing for free on the street + handing out tons of free cds (w/gig schedules & website info), touring all the time, spending $$$ on an experienced producer for their album, selling thousands of copies on their own, and licensing some tunes to video games and stuff. if they hadn't self-destructed, they could probably be getting screwed in a major label deal right now!

hahah yeah i am also hoping for some horror stories on this thread to make me reconsider my lofty ambitions of maybe one day not having to hold down a full time job in addition to making music

I don't have any particular horror stories because I didn't get that far. I did have a brush with success when my old band was on the "farm team" with some pretty heavy rollers. Nothing sleazy went down. Nothing much else went down either in terms of money or contracts. We played in front of some important people, we played venues we otherwise wouldn't have played. That was about it.

I would say this: if your main goal is to make money, being in a band is about the least effective, most risky way to do it. It's like the worst investment ever. You might as well just play your favorite roulette number over and over again and see if you come out ahead.

Ironically even a very talented and good looking musician who says "I have no integrity! I'll do anything for the money!" has only a slim chance of stardom. Hang out in Nashville and you'll see what I mean. Desperate unsigned hotties buying ad space on bus shelters, dropping tons of cash on coaching and clinics and whatnot.

I assume you're nowhere near that extreme and you like to actually have some pleasure in your music and your life. Making a modest living from your music is not an impossible goal. Practice. Hone your craft and your live show, build a local following, make contacts. Promote using mailing lists, myspace, fliers, youtube videos or whatever, and make sure you don't appear overly aggressive and eager because you don't want to turn people off (just use your common sense). Repeat. Repeat. Eventually you can start venturing to other cities within a few hours' drive. There's no rule for when shit will start to happen for you, if it does. It's an unpredictable business.

oh god no i dont want anything like pop stardom; the reason there's that stupid picture on my myspace is because i'm too embarassed to even pimp myself by having my real picture up! the whole 'selling out' thing was kind of a joke. that nashville scenario you describe sounds horrendous.

honestly, the only reason i want a modest, modest, income from music is simply so i can have the TIME to refine my music. my reasoning is if i get money from my music, i can spend more time doing that instead of working for the Man. who knows, maybe if i had the chance, i wouldn't even want to spend 8 hour days writing arranging playing and recording, but that's what i want right now. maybe i just need to find a place to squat or something, like MBV back in the day

anyways, thanks hurting, and congrats on your recent publicity

Thank you. By the way, I don't really make money from music and I have a day job.

Here's another piece of advice: Either find a day job that lets you take significant amounts of time off or develop a highly in-demand and lucrative temp worker skill. That way you can tour without having to worry about paying rent.

well, i'm a teacher, so i do get three months of paid time off; that is the light at the end of this particular tunnel this year. my other bandmate is web designer, the perfect job to also be in a band with, but the problem is a have to kick his ass to get him to turn on the keyboard when i'm not around

Yeah, teaching is one way to do it. Of course you get stuck touring at the worst times for an indie band (summer and school breaks), but it's an imperfect world.

summers off would be GREAT for me, that's when all the festivals are.

Teaching private music lessons seems like a pretty good way to support yourself for awhile if you can build up a full schedule and/or supplement it with something else on the side.

problem is that the private lesson field is so glutted now (because of all the other people trying to do the same thing) that if you play any common rock instrument (other than drums) it's nearly impossible to fill your schedule.

this situation is even worse if you have a music major centric college in your vicinity, which turns out a slew of people each year trying to justify the expenditure of music school.

So does anyone know much about submitting songs for use in commercials or tv? Is it as easy as finding a library that will accept your stuff or is there particular ones that are better?