Not late in the game but:
http://gearpatrol.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/arrested-development-3-years-5-months-2-days-in-the-life-of-album-cover.jpg
― Gus Van Sotosyn (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 17:42 (thirteen years ago) link
though the reviews almost suggest MBDTF is a zeitgeist fart like AD, I really think the overrating of a known commodity has more to do with it - sure people trumpeted the clash's clashness in their Sandinista raves.
― da croupier, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 17:47 (thirteen years ago) link
also, I think Kanye succeeds here insofar as he crafts an album and makes people pay attention to it as an album (via not having obvious singles + framing the whole thing as some sort of referendum on the state of music/culture/Kanye's mind 2k10) in a non-album age — I'm thinking here of Fred Jameson talking about how some historical moments are more conducive than others to the 'totalizing' gesture of the realistic novel, but replace 'realistic novel' with 'long-playing record' — obviously I'm not gonna claim that Kanye is "saving the album", or that he would really care whether he is or not; but he's trying to get people to pay attention to his album any way he can (Good Friday leaks, all-access Twitterrhea, expensively pretty 'high-art' music videos, etc), and it more or less worked.
― unemployed aerosmith fans I have shoved (bernard snowy), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 17:49 (thirteen years ago) link
(cf. the 4000-post thread I am posting in)
― unemployed aerosmith fans I have shoved (bernard snowy), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 17:50 (thirteen years ago) link
guess we should be glad it wasn't 3 CDs long
― da croupier, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 17:52 (thirteen years ago) link
next year in music headlines: Kanye West announces "life trade" with Sufjan Stevens; preps California Dreamin' for August release
― unemployed aerosmith fans I have shoved (bernard snowy), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 17:57 (thirteen years ago) link
EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW: Kanye West on American history, space travel, the pressures of fame, and what it's like to record Katy Perry playing a trumpet
― unemployed aerosmith fans I have shoved (bernard snowy), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 18:01 (thirteen years ago) link
EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW: John Mayer on American history, space travel, the pressures of fame, and what it's like to play Katy Perry like a trumpet
― da croupier, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 18:17 (thirteen years ago) link
i like the way this post has nothing to do with anything, so typically whiney
― lex diamonds (lex pretend), Wednesday, December 15, 2010 11:23 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark
^^this killed me
― *plop*timist (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:10 (thirteen years ago) link
i'm sympathetic to al's argument about how this will be seen in 20 years or w/e but unfortunately i can't really buy it -- i feel like critics have set up the narrative where, like, this right now is seen as the pinnacle of kanye's career artistically (ridiculous notion, but w/e)
honestly i think the arguments that al is making about this record will apply to late registration
― *plop*timist (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:13 (thirteen years ago) link
like in terms of a glossed over album i think the legacies of the albums will be (not that i think this is right but):
- college dropout: made a name for himself - late registration: solidified himself as a pop star with his biggest single ever- graduation: beefed with 50, won the sales battle(now we get into the 'now he became a force as a capital a Artist' period)- 808s: a divisive "artistic" record, i think what will be the legacy of this one is already pretty clear- twisted fantasy: the magnum opus, art-rap spectacular, talents fully realized as he makes a great capital a Album
― *plop*timist (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:17 (thirteen years ago) link
again, i think most of that is largely BS, but i think that's how it will play out
― *plop*timist (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:18 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah maybe you're right. to me croup's Imperial Bedroom/Little Creatures parallel just makes more sense to me but who knows really.
― some dude, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:19 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah -- i don't know enough about costello to analyze that comparison
― *plop*timist (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:21 (thirteen years ago) link
my beautiful dark twisted future fantasy, re: MBDTF's critical reappraisal, involves people changing their tune to "oh, it wasn't that bad after all, was it? in fact, it was pretty darn good.", or some such, actually. but that's just me. \m/ ^_^ \m/
― You're Twistin' My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy Man! (Ioannis), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:22 (thirteen years ago) link
all you need to know if that Costello's first 2-3 albums are total classics and his undeniable career peak and it's been diminishing returns since then but there were a few years that critics were in denial and sent lesser albums to the top of P&J
― some dude, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:26 (thirteen years ago) link
first paragraph of imperial bedroom review in RS: After years of furious parrying with his obsessions in a long ride that's taken him from arsenic tinged punk psychodramas to gin-mill country & western weepers, Elvis Costello has made his masterpiece.
Pretty sure every RS record guide since has given its highest ratings to his first two albums.
― da croupier, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:26 (thirteen years ago) link
lol, i mean first sentence. and here's the last bit: In every aspect of this masterfully wrought, conceptually audacious project, he's managed to bulwark his emotional directness with vision and clarity — and to make an album that lingers and haunts long after the last note has died out. Like a long, episodic novel — or a long, episodic relationship — you can look back when it's over and measure how far you've traveled.
― da croupier, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:28 (thirteen years ago) link
if only there was a 'mountain' reference to tie it into deej's topographical crit obsession too haha
― some dude, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:30 (thirteen years ago) link
there's really no "critical narrative" that can't be re-written
― da croupier, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:31 (thirteen years ago) link
diff being that IB was a bore then and remains a bore now.
― You're Twistin' My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy Man! (Ioannis), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:33 (thirteen years ago) link
― some dude, Wednesday, December 15, 2010 1:30 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
ha ok dude -- when this is seen as kanye's imperial bedroom you can claim your $5 *rmde*
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:41 (thirteen years ago) link
It kind of has that early-part-of-the-decade masterwork vibe like London Calling or Kid A where it's gonna sit around for 9 years and fester until crits just sort of agree its the best of the decade.
Crazy talk. Sandinista comparison much closer to the mark.
(I like Imperial Bedroom)
― The baby boomers have defined everything once and for all (Dorianlynskey), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:44 (thirteen years ago) link
that wasn't a boast or a wager about how right i am, i jut like making fun of your mountain analogy
― some dude, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:44 (thirteen years ago) link
why
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:46 (thirteen years ago) link
i mean as in, 'lol sparring' or 'how wrongheaded'?
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:47 (thirteen years ago) link
^progress
― k3vin k., Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:48 (thirteen years ago) link
lol sparring feels like it has meme potential
― call all destroyer, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:50 (thirteen years ago) link
i am a meme machine
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:51 (thirteen years ago) link
i am a me me machine― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, December 15, 2010 2:51 PM (53 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, December 15, 2010 2:51 PM (53 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― patti ayonnaise (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:52 (thirteen years ago) link
speaking of me-me machines, something that just occurred to me: in light of discussions about egotism/solipsism/etc, what's the significance of kanye literally not getting the 'last word' on his own album?
― unemployed aerosmith fans I have shoved (bernard snowy), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:54 (thirteen years ago) link
slightly desperate, transparent grab at giving the album a "larger significance" imo
― call all destroyer, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:56 (thirteen years ago) link
whiney that is a beef neither of us will win
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:56 (thirteen years ago) link
ive won all the other natch so it would be my only draw, just sayin
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 19:57 (thirteen years ago) link
the last thing he raps is:
"Let's break out of this fake-ass partyTurn this into a classic night <<<<< nice sentiment, p.good line imoIf we die in each other's armsStill get laid in that afterlife" <<<<< not so sure abt this one, mainly cuz it doesn't make sense
followed by a repetition of the chorus, now with the added "run from the lights / run from the night / run for your life" part that's always sorta reminded me of the Arcade Fire. and then Kanye slips into the background while Gil-Scott Heron takes the mic.
slightly desperate, transparent grab at giving the album a "larger significance" imo is probably otm — thing is, it actually sorta works for me! sonically/musically, I mean. I would listen to an album of Gil's raps set to Kanye's beats.
― unemployed aerosmith fans I have shoved (bernard snowy), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:00 (thirteen years ago) link
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, December 15, 2010 2:47 PM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
neither, it's not so much inherently funny as that you sold the whole 'mountain' thing for like 3 posts in a row before people finally went "uh we don't get it but ok dude"
― some dude, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:06 (thirteen years ago) link
"getting laid in the afterlife" is pretty funny, i want to like this album more now that i know that's the last line
i dont know how you 'couldnt get it' its rather straightforward
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:08 (thirteen years ago) link
― k3vin k., Wednesday, December 15, 2010 1:48 PM (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
apparently not, bcuz al was genuinely calling me an idiot
i was calling you an idiot? jeez don't be so dramatic dude
― some dude, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:10 (thirteen years ago) link
i'm not saying the mountain thing is hard to understand, you just sold it as SUCH a perfect way to look at things and nobody seemed to really get on board with it
― some dude, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:11 (thirteen years ago) link
the impression im getting is that al wants to will this album to be not-a-big-deal & the historical comparisons make so little sense. was imperial bedroom really a hugely successful pop phenomenon? did it even sell as many copies then as this record did in a worse climate for record sales? this is what i mean by a 'mountain' -- this record is a big deal to a lot of people & is thereby 'important' -- you cant just will it not to be by setting your disappointment with his execution up against that
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:11 (thirteen years ago) link
xposts re: "get laid in the afterlife" —
there's a weird suicide/death theme running through the album — the "standing on the edge" part from "Gorgeous" that I mentioned upthread, the MJ references (right before those last lines from "Lost in the World", he does the mamasay-mamasa-whateverwhatever part from that one song, then says "Lost in this plastic life" which obviously resonates with the figure of Jackson in interesting ways) — maybe Kanye really is a teenager at heart and his beautiful dark twisted fantasy is "I'm gonna die and you'll all be rly sad"
― unemployed aerosmith fans I have shoved (bernard snowy), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:12 (thirteen years ago) link
the coda to power too, of course
― call all destroyer, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:13 (thirteen years ago) link
― some dude, Wednesday, December 15, 2010 2:11 PM (40 seconds ago) Bookmark
its certainly a better line of thought than the linear progress narrative most music writing still latches on to. if you have a problem with it then call me out on it instead of being passive aggressive & zingy 200 posts later
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:13 (thirteen years ago) link
xpost ah yeah, knew I was missing something
― unemployed aerosmith fans I have shoved (bernard snowy), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:14 (thirteen years ago) link
what was the mountain thing?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UO76M2MRCFw
no seward
― patti ayonnaise (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:15 (thirteen years ago) link
― *plop*ism rules (deej), Wednesday, December 15, 2010 3:11 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
i'm sorry you thinking i'm DENYING THE MOUNTAIN. i know it's a big deal! i'm just truly honestly not sure it's that much bigger a deal than Late Registration. if you think that makes me seem stubborn it's ok dude.
― some dude, Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:16 (thirteen years ago) link
acting like the Imperial Bedroom comparison has to make sense on every single level to hold weight is like saying "does this album have a 5 mile high elevation? is it covered in rocks? then it's NOT A MOUNTAIN"
stop denying the mountain
― kanellos (gbx), Wednesday, 15 December 2010 20:17 (thirteen years ago) link