Rhymesayers vs. Definitive Jux vs. Everyone (or Anyone) Else

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The battle of independent hip-hop labels... Which one is the best now? Which one has the best shot for world domination in the future?

― Brian O'Neill (NYCNative), Monday, 23 January 2006 23:35 (twenty years ago)

World domination? Hmmmmm, difficult to say.

― adamrl (nordicskilla), Monday, 23 January 2006 23:37 (twenty years ago)

don't forget Stones Throw

― J. Lamphere (WatchMeJumpStart), Monday, 23 January 2006 23:49 (twenty years ago)

I was sure this was going to be an Ellis thread. Anyway that I Self Divine album is pretty great as far as indie rap goes and it's too bad that it's probably going to sell 1/1000th of Atmosphere's latest rehash.

― deej.. (deej..), Monday, 23 January 2006 23:55 (twenty years ago)

x-post

1. P.O.S. on Rhymesayers should be, and probably will be, a big deal. I still think the Atmosphere and I Self Devine albums might gain in regard once people have actually heard them... Those are great albums.
http://doomtree.net
http://rhymesayers.com

2. Pigeon John on Quannum should be, but probably won't be, a big deal. I'm looking forward to it, anyway. That Lyrics Born remix album was one of the best rap albums of last year, and Jeff Chang's history book and journalism, though not officially tied to the label, deserves a mention.
http://www.pigeonjohn.com/
http://quannum.com

3. Aceyalone and RJD2's album on Project Blowed should be, and probably will be, a medium-sized deal. I like RJD2 a lot, and love the first Cannibal Ox album, as well as a lot of other El-P production, but I don't find myself listening to much other Def Jux stuff for pleasure, to be honest.
http://www.projectblowed.com/
http://www.definitivejux.net/

Stones Throw is kind of its own category, and a great reissue label.

― Pete Scholtes (Pete Scholtes), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 00:17 (twenty years ago)

That Aceyalone album is lame, which is sad because I like both artists individually. Ace1 still rocks a show live too.

― deej.. (deej..), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 01:35 (twenty years ago)

Me being a hometown booster and all that rap-destroying poser shit aside, Rhymesayers in a walk; Doom + Ali + Felt + Atmosphere + P.O.S. + I Self Divine is way better than peak '01-'03 Jux for me.

― disco violence (disco violence), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 02:01 (twenty years ago)

does def jux still put out records? i do not care for that p.o.s. album.

― scott seward (scott seward), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 02:04 (twenty years ago)

acey went out like a bitch

― howell huser (chaki), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 02:15 (twenty years ago)

Don't forget Brother Ali and Blueprint!

Rhymesayers is definitely on a winning streak, tho the new SA Smash is probably going to be beserk if the songs they do live are any indication.

― Whiney G. Weingarten (whineyg), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 02:33 (twenty years ago)

NOT RHYMESAYERS.

― sovietpanda (sovietpanda), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 03:50 (twenty years ago)

DEFINITELY RHYMESAYERS.

― John Justen (johnjusten), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 04:16 (twenty years ago)

rhymesayers=dud

and stones throw is so much more than a reissue label

― lf (lfam), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 04:39 (twenty years ago)

Why does oberlin feel that rhymesayers=dud?

― John Justen (johnjusten), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 04:56 (twenty years ago)

All these labels suck and put out shitty music made for farm-rap loving gays.

Hydra Records forever instead !!!!!!!!!!!!

― GEEKY JEW FROM MINNE$OTA, Tuesday, 24 January 2006 15:37 (twenty years ago)

Greyskul (Rhymesayers) rules all!

― Huk-L (Huk-L), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 15:50 (twenty years ago)

I'll take Everyone (or Anyone) Else.

I would say Rhymesayers for having MF Doom, but they also have Atmosphere, which outweighs it.

― R. J. Greene, Tuesday, 24 January 2006 19:14 (twenty years ago)

Rhymesayers by miles

― Matos-Webster Dictionary (M Matos), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 23:31 (twenty years ago)

I haven't heard the new Aceyalone except online, so I'll reserve judgement on that. Scott, check out the new P.O.S., coming out in a couple weeks. That's the one I mean.

― Pete Scholtes (Pete Scholtes), Tuesday, 24 January 2006 23:48 (twenty years ago)

one year passes...

been a long long time since i listened to a hip hop album that i enjoyed as much as Brother Alis new one - The Undisputed Thruth.
yes its laid back old school loops that ignores all the cyber production tricks that people like in 2007, but damn, i have listened to the album 3 times in a row and loving it.
produced by ANT whoever he be.
i guess i need to track down more rhymesayers stuff now ?

― mark e, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 15:15 (nineteen years ago)

What about Plague Language (Noah23!) and Peanuts & Corn (McEnroe, John Smith)?

― xhg, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 15:34 (nineteen years ago)

I like Brother Ali and I Self Devine a lot

― deej, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 15:38 (nineteen years ago)

sorry xhg - those names mean nothing to me.
not seen much in the racks today from Rhymesayers, i suspect a lot of this has probably not made it to uk shores (or is it just Bristol now that Replay has closed down ??)
however, saw the Atmosphere album so will be checking that.
i reckon i'd like that I Self Devine album...

― mark e, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 15:48 (nineteen years ago)

destroy.

― artdamages, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 15:51 (nineteen years ago)

wait yeah brother ali is cool, i have seen him like 5 times and even if he insulted lil jon he seems like a fairly nice and humble guy. umm...i am mildly nostalgic about Overcast! cuz im from MN and thought it was the best ever like 10 years ago or whenever that was. ant or whoever that dude is does some good production sometimes. its Rhymesayers, by a mile. but im not that enthused about either.

still im not trying to rip on all undie shit like a typical ilmer. i do love backpacks. they are very convenient! and native tongues forever! someone officially reinstate it again. (and as someone mentioned on another thread J Beez W/the Remedy is a def. precursor to some of the EL-P type production)

― artdamages, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 16:03 (nineteen years ago)

Why does oberlin feel that rhymesayers=dud?

John Justen (johnjusten) on Tuesday, 24 January 2006 04:56 (1 year ago)

because it's all a bunch of pre-teen sad sack bunk! was overcast on rhymesayers? i've heard to0 many people rep that to dismiss it without hearing it but otherwise ruck fhymesayers.

― lfam, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 16:41 (nineteen years ago)

no one on rhymesayers recorded as a preteen. are you thinking of kriss kross? they weren't really sad sacks. their music makes me happy.

― artdamages, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 18:26 (nineteen years ago)

rhymesayer's non-atmosphere stuff is pretty cool. and i even like a lot of atmosphere.

rhymesayers released that monster island czars record that is sweet.

i always mean to check out the micranauts too.

― M@tt He1ges0n, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 19:07 (nineteen years ago)

yeah im not a huge rhymesayers expert, but there are too many people who universally love what they do because of where they are from or how they rhyme about lattes or whatever.

― artdamages, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 19:16 (nineteen years ago)

I really like Brother Ali--that record is pretty great and he puts on good live shows.

I loved Definitive Jux in high school, and even if I never listen to them anymore I will still rep Company Flow and the Cold Vein. Aesop Rock I'm less sure about ("Daylight" was my favorite song for, like, ever).

― max, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 20:03 (nineteen years ago)

Why would people that hate this stuff post in this thread so much?

― Whiney G. Weingarten, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 20:15 (nineteen years ago)

for kicks?

― lfam, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 21:56 (nineteen years ago)

Proving allegiance to the hivemind?
i haven't listened to def jux stuff in ages although i liked el-p's album and canox's album back back then then.
Atmosphere's stuff i find to be oppressively solipsistic but rhymesayers has as i said before i self divine and brother ali who are both great, and Ant's production work is actually really pretty good.

― deej, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 22:04 (nineteen years ago)

also, as much as i've gotten sick of atmosphere's schtick....slug puts on a great live show. those guys tour a lot and it shows.

― M@tt He1ges0n, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 22:08 (nineteen years ago)

overcast is classic.

slug is sane & sweet since lucy ford. eyedea is crazy & has a flow but no ear and too much coke.

i self divine & brother ali r good. have u heard the early micranauts stuff dj? minneapolis is cold sometimes.

el-pz done a grip of great instrumentals & vast aire spit dope verses. 'no regrets' was understandable

― luriqua, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 23:48 (nineteen years ago)

i wish i liked rhymesayers more.

― artdamages, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 23:54 (nineteen years ago)

or i wish it was something it isn't. and its a hometown thing so that accounts for some of my conflicted feelings.

(in answer to whiney xpost)

― artdamages, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 23:56 (nineteen years ago)

have u heard the early micranauts stuff dj? minneapolis is cold sometimes.

no i really heard good things.

― M@tt He1ges0n, Tuesday, 6 March 2007 23:59 (nineteen years ago)

anticon was the best at the sad drugged out whiteboy instrumental tho, took it to the extreme & out of their element, got cliche & corny & worse, softer, with confidence. jel holds it down tho.

― luriqua, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 00:00 (nineteen years ago)

i love the clouddead comp. that hip hop for the advancement of white people thing was terrible though.

― artdamages, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 00:08 (nineteen years ago)

micranots**

― luriqua, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 00:12 (nineteen years ago)

the most recent subtle album was great. And altho neither of them have done anything that's matched Cold Vein, both Vast and Vordul have put out middling-to-enjoyable solo stuff (especially the Vast Aire/DJ Mighty Mi thing, which I liked a lot).

― max, Wednesday, 7 March 2007 00:28 (nineteen years ago)

I dig rhymesayers' stuff. Plenty of good records to be found in their catalog. and to all you atmosphere bashers -- Slug, unlike 95% of MCs working today can rock a live show.

If Def Jux ever gets around to releasing the Despot 11 song "EP" they will have a good record on the shelves..

― UncleTomfly, Thursday, 8 March 2007 08:54 (nineteen years ago)

I saw Atmosphere live once. Depressing experience. (Although I hate them, so I'd say that.)

― The Reverend, Thursday, 8 March 2007 09:59 (nineteen years ago)

all the sorority girls love slug.

― artdamages, Thursday, 8 March 2007 13:20 (nineteen years ago)

http://www.robharvey.com/pest-control/images/slug-bait-safe-lg.jpg

Pour this on the muhfucker.

― The Reverend, Thursday, 8 March 2007 16:09 (nineteen years ago)

the more you hate, the more girls slug gets.

― UncleTomfly, Thursday, 8 March 2007 20:28 (nineteen years ago)

http://www.rawkus.com/content/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/puffy-and-el-p.jpg

:-O

― deej, Thursday, 8 March 2007 20:48 (nineteen years ago)

I know for a fact there are huge Rhymesayers fans on the staff at Vibe, yet the label got snubbed in the new "150 essential Vibe Albums" list. I guess I haven't heard J-Live's debut, but is it really better than Lucy Ford? Then again, there's a lot I love about the list as a whole; I think it's the only canon that rightly includes D'Angelo's Brown Sugar as one of the all-time great R&B albums.

Vibe's top albums from "The Underground":

Company Flow, Funcrusher Plus
Freestyle Fellowship, Innercity Griots
Organized Konfusion, Stress (The Extinction Agenda)
Black Star, Mos Def and Talib Kweli Are Black Star
MF Doom, Operation: Doomsday
Prince Pual, A Prince Among Thieves
Quasimoto, The Unseen
Slum Village, Fantastic Voyage, Vol. 2
Cannibal Ox, The Cold Vein
J-Live, The Best Part

― Pete Scholtes, Thursday, 8 March 2007 22:39 (nineteen years ago)

Organized Konfusion, Stress (The Extinction Agenda)

this album crushes all!

i like j-live pretty much...i dunno if it's all time great, nothing by him ever really grabbed me as much as the song "satisfied" did

― M@tt He1ges0n, Thursday, 8 March 2007 22:42 (nineteen years ago)

i had a period where i tried to get into j-live. i failed. he sounds like a middle school language arts teacher. oh what do you know, he is.

― deej, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:19 (nineteen years ago)

is slum village really that good? every random song i ever heard by them was kinda boring...maybe i should try again...

― M@tt He1ges0n, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:24 (nineteen years ago)

i talked to brother ali's dj once at a show and he sez he loves organized konfusion! Slum Villiage vol 2 is the fucking jam as is all the ATCQQ/Q-Tip Ummah shit. i should check out Vol 1.

― artdamages, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:35 (nineteen years ago)

Slum Village do suck, that is true.

― The Reverend, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:35 (nineteen years ago)

the more you hate, the more girls slug gets.

UncleTomfly on Friday, March 9, 2007 5:58 AM (3 hours ago)

oh noes internet board dude says popular rapper gets more girls than fellow internet board dude.

― artdamages, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:36 (nineteen years ago)

black star sounds kinda lame and preachy in retrospect.

― artdamages, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:37 (nineteen years ago)

im not even gonna fuck w/your name.

― artdamages, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:39 (nineteen years ago)

btw pete did an awesome article a few months back about the other kind of underground hip-hop. i had no idea the twin cities had dudes doing mixtapes. but then i don't get out much.

― artdamages, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:40 (nineteen years ago)

black star sounds kinda lame and preachy in retrospect.

artdamages on Thursday, March 8, 2007 5:37 PM (10 minutes ago)

really : (

i haven't listened to it in years i remember loving it.

― M@tt He1ges0n, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:49 (nineteen years ago)

i think i bought it cuz they were in rollingstone's HOT issue or whatever it was called. i ate all that shit up back then. black on both sides + tony hawk = HS nostalgia

― artdamages, Thursday, 8 March 2007 23:54 (nineteen years ago)

i should check out Vol 1.

yes you should. who are you btw? like did you have an old sn on here
i'm still ok on 1/3rd of the songs from the black star album, maybe more.

― deej, Friday, 9 March 2007 00:16 (nineteen years ago)

i haven't posted for a long time - but i have spring break and my gf is out of town. uh this is the name i've used for probably 2 years? before that it was chr1sth@mrin

― artdamages, Friday, 9 March 2007 00:22 (nineteen years ago)

i really liked that "crosstown beef" or whatever song w/that other group mos def was in, medina green....i have the cd single somewhere, did they ever put out an album?

― M@tt He1ges0n, Friday, 9 March 2007 20:34 (nineteen years ago)

The new Ali album pretty much settles the initial thread question in my mind.

So much more listenable than the soulless shit I hear on corporate radio.

Makes me happy to say I'm from the Midwest.

― Siah Alan, Sunday, 11 March 2007 07:33 (nineteen years ago)

Did U Know?????: Sage Francid has a side project called Twizted. i head it last night--

― luriqua, Sunday, 11 March 2007 21:16 (nineteen years ago)

one month passes...

Rawkus: The Last Great Hope for Hip-Hop

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Thursday, 3 May 2007 02:13 (nineteen years ago)

remember when "independent" hip hop collectives were actually good? none of the above even come close to hiero or boot camp's prime output in the early to mid 90's

― venimdenim, Thursday, 3 May 2007 02:33 (nineteen years ago)

three weeks pass...

WHATS BETTER OK OLD CAGE OR NEW CAGE

― luriqua, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 18:06 (nineteen years ago)

OLD CAGE BY FAR

― luriqua, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 18:06 (nineteen years ago)

I CANT STAND NEW CAGE

― luriqua, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 18:06 (nineteen years ago)

WIGGER CAGE WAS SICKEST

― luriqua, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 18:06 (nineteen years ago)

NEW CAGE IS A MISFITS SHIRT WEARING FAST TIMES AT RIDGGEMONT HIGH POLKA DOT SPICOLLI SHOE WEARER

― luriqua, Tuesday, 29 May 2007 18:07 (nineteen years ago)

ten months pass...

Def Jux > Stones Throw > Rhymesayers

― stephen, Tuesday, 8 April 2008 21:37 (eighteen years ago)

i think you have it backwards

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 8 April 2008 21:42 (eighteen years ago)

WIGGER CAGE WAS SICKEST

-- luriqua, Tuesday, May 29, 2007 6:06 PM (10 months ago) Bookmark Link

NEW CAGE IS A MISFITS SHIRT WEARING FAST TIMES AT RIDGGEMONT HIGH POLKA DOT SPICOLLI SHOE WEARER

-- luriqua, Tuesday, May 29, 2007 6:07 PM (10 months ago) Bookmark Link

rip

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 8 April 2008 21:43 (eighteen years ago)

http://www.itsalreadysigned4u.com/shop/media/images/product_detail/AAA-20237.jpg

― J0rdan S., Tuesday, 8 April 2008 21:44 (eighteen years ago)

i think you have it backwards

okay then

Rhymesayers < Stones Throw < Def Jux

― stephen, Tuesday, 8 April 2008 21:44 (eighteen years ago)

ha kudos

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 8 April 2008 21:50 (eighteen years ago)

megalolz @ j0 btw

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 8 April 2008 21:51 (eighteen years ago)

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