Tusk Vs The White Album

bwaaaahhhahahahhhahahahaahhaha. So wrong it hurts.

As for who wins the fight; I guess I've listened to Tusk a lot more than "The Beatles" recently, but c'mon: I Will. Martha My Dear. Blackbird. Good Night. Long Long Long. Er...actually that's about it as far as I'm concerned...

OK, Tusk it is, as it doesn't have anything as repellent as Piggies.

"Sara" is perfection!

But I agree, as much as I love it, Tusk has some iffy moments.

Where have I been?

I smile every time Lindsey says "Reeeeeeal savage-like."

But it's hard to deny The White Album, so I won't even try.

* A joke, but only in part!

"You can love me babytimmy but you can't walk out/
Someone oughta tell you what it's really all about"

The White Album is a meisterwerk!*

* IMO!!!

Tusk changes a fair bit the more I listen to it. For years, I went straight for the Lindsey songs, and ignored the rest. Eventually, I grew to like a fair number of the Nicks songs, and the odd McVie song. From my perspective, Buckingham is on fire, while Nicks and McVie aren't necessarily on the top of their game. Nicks was much stronger on s/t and Rumours, and so was McVie. McVie also went on to contribute perhaps the best songs on Mirage and Tango In The Night.

The White Album on the other hand, shows all members (save Ringo) on fire. Everyone misfires, but everyone also contributes multiple crowning jewels. Therefore, White Album!

Never heard Tusk.

"Never Make Me Cry" is the cruel aftermath. Everything she's predicted has come true: he's a liar, a cheater, a horrible disappointment. But she keeps her dignity. You feel all this in the wrecked pathos of McVie's voice, trembling and delayed and, finally, isolated thanks to Buckingham's production.

I have to think about it some more. Thse two songs have always seemed like the emotional core of an album that's often lauded as a "mere" triumph of a mad genius behind the boards.

As for Nicks' weaker songs, well, I must admit that "Sisters of the Moon" is one song about Rhiannon too many. "Angel" never did much for me either. But "Sara" - wow. It was Lester Bangs who defended Nicks as a songwriter of great insight, and he cited the line "When you build your house, then call me home" as an example.

Re Stevie and Christine: Sara and Angel are great, Sister of the Moon OK, Storms kinda boring. I'm also not such a fan of Brown Eyes. Beautiful Child is a much nicer song, but it would be even better if it didn't come after Brown Eyes and sound a little the same. But that's about it for stuff I don't like on Tusk.

Also, the "experimentation" on the White Album was very cliched even then; the freshest thing about it was its range, not anything they actually did. Tusk sounded like absolutely nothing else in 1980.

Mmmm well, on Tango yes (the peerless "Little Lies" and "Everywhere") but Mirage boasts "Hold Me," "Love in Store," and then two just awfully bland songs ("Wish You Were Here," "Only Over You").

Yes. And that includes the surviving Beatles and the estates of those deceased.

Still, I'll give the edge to The Beatles on the strength of "While My Guitar Gently Weeps," "Happiness Is A Warm Gun," "I'm So Tired, and "Everybody's Got Something To Hide Except Me And My Monkey."

Kim Thayil circa Superunknown cops heavily from "Monkey," and that's no knock on Kim Thayil.

"Also, the 'experimentation' on the White Album was very cliched even then; the freshest thing about it was its range, not anything they actually did."

If you want to say that "Revolution 9" was "very cliched" because it was just more musique concrete, then fine, I guess. I actually like the way the piece works in the context of the album. But otherwise, the range of the album that you mention WAS experimental, in a sense. The White Album is a startling thing for a band to have created one year after they did Sgt. Pepper.

"Not anything they actually did," you say? They're the ones that made the music.

"I think Stevie's songs are great, or at least, just as great as her other songs. I mean, she's never been anywhere near the caliber of Lindsey or Christie as far as songwriting goes..."

What? What?!

Exhibit A:

"Dreams" written by a hot young Stevie Nicks:

Have you any dreams you’d like to sell?
Dreams of loneliness...
Like a heartbeat... drives you mad...
In the stillness of remembering what you had...

And just to give her the benefit of the doubt, let's consider the best work of McVie from the same album- "You Make Loving Fun" - Exhibit B:

I never did believe in miracles,
But I've a feeling it's time to try.
I never did believe in the ways of magic,
But I'm beginning to wonder why.

yeah, I never did either, and now I really don't...and it gets worse. I'll spare you.

(I haven't figured out the italics thing yet)

Fuuck yoooooouuuuuu

I'd have to go with the White Album though and i love it all. Part of the reason I like it so much is because it's imperfect and sprawling. People who want to split it down to a 'perfect' 14 track album or whatever are missing the point about what makes it so good.

I can understand the hating on Revolution 9 but again it's part of what makes this album great. What other band of their size would be sticking tracks like this on an album and sandwiched up beside an OTT string laden nursery rhyme. You could argue it's self indulgent and no one was questioning what they were doing but I'm glad it's on there. A real headphone treat and bringing something like this to the mainstream is defnitely not an expiremental cliche.

Tusk is great too though I am a recent convert.

I'll end up getting "Tusk" and listening and go "Mergh"

For Savoy Truffle!

I realized the other day that the song "Tusk" taps into the sort of primal rush that the Animal Collective have done so well recently.

Yeah, I know he is, but you're gonna have to search long and hard to find his posts on the thread for any other funk band.

Glad we're all finally admitting it, though.

hi, so is the White Album any good

Too artsy to be funky, so that's a no.

Indeed. None of this has anything to do with The Beatles or Tusk, I guess this means that the Beatle cult struggle to stay on topic when challenged.

FYI the White Album is better than Tusk

https://i.makeagif.com/media/5-17-2015/lNO8dg.gif

https://68.media.tumblr.com/c375dbe8e9f678af0c3ff0ed54a64b8c/tumblr_oua4zzNyhJ1rvlgz8o3_500.gif

LOL that my revive kicked off a whole nother cycle of Turrican trolling

also stop calling it The Beatles it's called The White Album ffs

Turdican Strikes Again!

what's the funniest part of the white album, i think it's when paul wails "OH NO IT'S HELTER SKELTER" in a high pitched voice

"they are -standing- stilllll"

Hehbub zeebubbhahbub zebub

Always gets a chuckle

"Back in the USSR" is the funniest thing on the White Album!

ha yes, especially being the opening track!

with tusk maybe it's more about "what's the moment that makes you feel most vulnerable" or something, there are so many.

^ probably Over & Over for me

which is such a bizarre song to open an album with, it's such a 'middle of side 3' kind of song. the sequencing of Tusk is really interesting too, I always thought the album sounded like a loop, in kinda opens in media res. TWA is much more of a journey with a solid beginning, middle, and end. listening to Tusk is like walking in on a party that never started and never ended

there are a good number songs on TWA that, had they been released as private press 45s from some unknown band in ohio or florida or something, i imagine they'd fetch three figures on the secondhand market, be anthologized on "pebbles" or similar, and be regarded as stone cold classics of the psychedelic genre.

otm, i could easily see some of the songs on TWA having the appeal of someone like Harvey Sid Fisher in another universe

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLfe3dBb69k

whoops sorry this is the hit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cy3LcfkYHV4

my personal favorite

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ecvNT5OGnMg

The funniest moment on The Beatles? Probably one of the moments where it's not trying to be funny ... the ending to 'Happiness is a Warm Gun' is a great example of this, the "when ah hold yooou in maaaah arms" part made me laugh out loud the first time I heard it.

i don't think you have a soul

I suspect there's more than a few songs on The Beatles that would have been swept under the carpet and forgotten about by now if they hadn't appeared on a Beatles album. A lot of these tracks have been over-scrutinised for this exact reason.

Donald Trump vs The White Album

i don't think you have a soul

... or understand the concept of 'funny'... or 'spooky'... or anything else really.

Probably one of the moments where it's not trying to be funny ... the ending to 'Happiness is a Warm Gun' is a great example of this, the "when ah hold yooou in maaaah arms" part made me laugh out loud the first time I heard it.

Given the provenance of the song, the idea that the band (and John specifically) were not trying to be funny here is . . . "mind-boggling" doesn't even BEGIN to cover it. Deliberately obtuse, but in a Dunning-Kruger kind of way.

yeah that shit is funny and i’m pretty sure they knew it

they're definitely not trying to take themselves seriously on that song. or pretty much any song on that album save for, like, Julia or something

The Beatles as a series of jokes. Hmm, yeah... I can get on board with that assessment.

Take one of "Happiness, BOOM BOOM hrah ah ah ah"

http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/875000/images/_879875_basilbrush_300.jpg

Funniest is Yoko's line in Bungalow Bill. I always thought it was John doing a silly voice.

Also the version of Obladi on Anthology at the end of which John is mocking Paul with, "Obladi blada, brother."

Yeah it never occurred to me that that was Yoko. Bungalow Bill's Beach Boys analogue would be 'Little Pad'

Ooh good connection

Arent Yoko (and Patti?) also on Birthday?

Yoko also appears on Revolution 9 'you become naked...'

Speaking of which, I wouldn't mind hearing Turrican's opinion of Smiley Smile, which is one of my favourite albums of all time and for similar reasons to White Album.

I guess the unifying things between all these, including Tusk and also Sandinista and countless others is that they're 'burn out' albums with cult followings.
Band reach what is largely regarded as the peak of their work. They've worked hard, put all their creative powers into their album. They've sweated and worked and collaborated with each other and argued and drugged themselves and had love affairs and the world loves them.
They set out to make a follow-up, but find it impossible to summon the patience to go through these motions. They're still brimming with ideas, their egos suitably lubricated, but the sheer effort involved with working like that and living with each other again is too much.
So they work fast and get a bit scrappy - 'we know what we're doing this time, we're The Beatles, we don't need to sweat over this like we used to cos we're pros'.
They take shortcuts, pump out the songs, preferably with as few of the other members around as possible.
And so you end up with these big, dopey, mishmash albums that are weirdly appealing but tonally all over the place. They don't quite compare to their predecessors because they're in a different league. Critically, they come across as flawed but in an endearing way.

FYI the White Album is better than Tusk

― Οὖτις, Tuesday, November 7, 2017 2:19 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

probably but I only listen to Tusk anymore

The Smiley Smile version of 'Wind Chimes' is a zillion times creepier than anything on The Beatles. I've said this before on a Beach Boys thread, but the thing about Smiley Smile is that it's a far less commercial/inviting record than Smile would have been, and more uncompromising too.

You mean "Wonderful" yeah?

Xp Well I wasn't asking about which was creepier. I agree, Smiley Smile has some very eerie moments on it - Fall Breaks and Back To Winter is another.
Would you say the same about Peppers/TWA as you would about Pet Sounds/Smiley Smile?

I take it TWA didn't start off as originally intended either.. did the Beatles have another concept in mind before choosing on a double album of genre exercises?

Bungalow Bill is garbage, Little Pad is transplendent, I don't see the connection.

You mean "Wonderful" yeah?

― Mark G, Wednesday, November 8, 2017 4:13 PM (twenty-two minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

That too. The Smile version of 'Wonderful' is stunningly beautiful, but the Smiley Smile sounds like a paranoid episode set to music.

*version

Would you say the same about Peppers/TWA as you would about Pet Sounds/Smiley Smile?

No. I'm also unconvinced that The Beatles ever had a concept in mind for The Beatles beyond them having a lot of material between them and seemingly being unwilling/unable (for whatever reason) to work out what to record and what not to record.

Yeah, I think it's significant that there is only one tiny photo of them altogether on the poster inamongst the other pics

i love the mouse on mars track that samples "wind chimes"

Woah, what now?

harvey sid fisher was on my radio show a few weeks ago!
tusk is better

xp It's on vulvaland, samples a bit of the vocals and speeds them up, it sounds really cool