It's the "radical re-invention" TS you've doubtlessly been expecting/anticipating/dreading.
U2 discover irony and go all rock. REM discover power chords and go all rock!
Sort've a no brainer, I'd say, but I'll keep my opinion quiet for now. What say you?
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 23 October 2004 17:53 (nineteen years ago) link
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 23 October 2004 17:54 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:04 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:05 (nineteen years ago) link
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:06 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:06 (nineteen years ago) link
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:07 (nineteen years ago) link
― sundar subramanian (sundar), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:07 (nineteen years ago) link
― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:11 (nineteen years ago) link
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:13 (nineteen years ago) link
― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:16 (nineteen years ago) link
xpost I totally don't see how the songs on this are duller than those on the previous three albums. I think I said before it's like the best hooks of 70s CBGBs bounced around the reverberating, stereo-panning studio walls.
― sundar subramanian (sundar), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:16 (nineteen years ago) link
― sundar subramanian (sundar), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:18 (nineteen years ago) link
Welcome to my world.
― Johnny Fever (johnny fever), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:19 (nineteen years ago) link
― sundar subramanian (sundar), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:20 (nineteen years ago) link
― My name is Kenny (My name is Kenny), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:20 (nineteen years ago) link
― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:22 (nineteen years ago) link
What's The Frequency vs. Zoo Station: U2Crush With Eyeliner vs. Even Better Than The Real Thing: REMKing Of Comedy vs. One: U2I Don't Sleep, I Dream vs. Until The End Of The World: U2Star 69 vs. Who's Gonna Ride Your Wild Horses: REMStrange Currencies vs. So Cruel: REMTongue vs. The Fly: U2 (battle of the falsettos!)Bang And Blame vs. Mysterious Ways: U2 (battle of the second singles!)I Took Your Name vs. Trying To Throw Your Arms Around The World: macho rawk or macho ballad ("woman, be still")? ugh. REM, I guess.Let Me In vs. Ultraviolet: REM (close though, but I love the organ part)Circus Envy vs. Acrobat: REMYou vs. Love Is Blindness: REM
I thought U2 would get it cuz of "One" (which Michael Stipe even COVERED with "Automatic Baby"), but REM grabs it song-for-song I think. Unless you dig Bono drama.
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:25 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:27 (nineteen years ago) link
Monster was the first album by R.E.M. I flat out didn't care about. My memory tells me that it all blended together into an undiscernable glop, though I'm sure it's not the case. One thing that does stand out in my mind though is how lazy Peter Buck sounds on this album.
― frankE (frankE), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:30 (nineteen years ago) link
Monster was also the dawn of Mike Mills' silly vegas outfit era, which it seems he still hasn't recovered from.
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:36 (nineteen years ago) link
― Lord Custos Epsilon (Lord Custos Epsilon), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:37 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:37 (nineteen years ago) link
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:38 (nineteen years ago) link
― Lord Custos Epsilon (Lord Custos Epsilon), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:39 (nineteen years ago) link
― Lord Custos Epsilon (Lord Custos Epsilon), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:40 (nineteen years ago) link
Peter Buck says he likes it in the sense that he loves listening to crazy Neil Young genre albums, wondering what the heck they were thinking. I'm guessing they're prouder of some of the songcraft on New Adventures, which does have some specific individual songs that top anything here, but the whole is really bloated compared to Monster.
Monster is sure as hell better than Pop as far as big regrets though. And frankly REM should regret not breaking up in 1997 more than anything else.
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:42 (nineteen years ago) link
― Riot Gear! (Gear!), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:47 (nineteen years ago) link
― sundar subramanian (sundar), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:49 (nineteen years ago) link
― sundar subramanian (sundar), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:50 (nineteen years ago) link
xpostNew Adventures [...] is really bloated compared to Monster.
Oh God. Please do not get me started again.
― frankE (frankE), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:51 (nineteen years ago) link
― sundar subramanian (sundar), Saturday, 23 October 2004 18:53 (nineteen years ago) link
Achtung is an all-time great album, while Monster is merely a neat experiment.
― Chris O., Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:00 (nineteen years ago) link
― eddie hurt (ddduncan), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:01 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:04 (nineteen years ago) link
this is easily the most anyone's gotten out of selling back a copy of monster.
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:11 (nineteen years ago) link
― danh (danh), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:14 (nineteen years ago) link
Hrmmm. Certainly not musically over the top. Seems to be just an upade of the old Edge with a rhythm (ie. a funkier bassist than U2 ever had and a turn-down-the-snare-and-kick, turn-up-that-tamborine percussion). Maybe lyrically, if you think emoting in lyrics is over the top. I mean, those words are pretty heavy, very nicely written and delivered nicely. Interestingly, "So Cruel" does the same thing with a nice little piano riff immediately after to also to great effect.
xpost:In a way, it reminds of Reveal by REM.
Ha! I feel the same way to an apparently 180 degree opposite conclusion.
― frankE (frankE), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:15 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:16 (nineteen years ago) link
― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:17 (nineteen years ago) link
Chuck Eddy to thread! (though i'll run like its a grenade when that happens)
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:21 (nineteen years ago) link
― danh (danh), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:28 (nineteen years ago) link
And yes, "The Fly" was played in clubs, IIRC.
― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:32 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:42 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:45 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 19:46 (nineteen years ago) link
― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Saturday, 23 October 2004 20:00 (nineteen years ago) link
― manthony m1cc1o (Anthony Miccio), Saturday, 23 October 2004 20:03 (nineteen years ago) link
― frankE (frankE), Saturday, 23 October 2004 20:09 (nineteen years ago) link
― M. V. (M.V.), Saturday, 28 October 2006 20:14 (seventeen years ago) link
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Saturday, 28 October 2006 20:34 (seventeen years ago) link
― j blount (papa la bas), Saturday, 28 October 2006 21:51 (seventeen years ago) link
― j blount (papa la bas), Saturday, 28 October 2006 21:56 (seventeen years ago) link
― max (maxreax), Saturday, 28 October 2006 22:10 (seventeen years ago) link
― Doctor Casino (Doctor Casino), Saturday, 28 October 2006 22:32 (seventeen years ago) link
. . . and a couple hundred more in the back.!
― Stephen Bush (Stephen B.), Saturday, 28 October 2006 22:33 (seventeen years ago) link
― the orchid and the wasp (Jody Beth Rosen), Saturday, 28 October 2006 22:51 (seventeen years ago) link
That's my favorite part of the song! It's one of those stupid ideas executed brilliantly, with diminishing returns, as the years went on.
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Saturday, 28 October 2006 22:52 (seventeen years ago) link
An even better thread idea might be to compare the albums' first singles: "The Fly" vs "What's the Frequency, Kenneth?" At the time I was less prepared for the U2 song.
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Saturday, 28 October 2006 22:53 (seventeen years ago) link
― Doctor Casino (Doctor Casino), Saturday, 28 October 2006 23:25 (seventeen years ago) link
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Saturday, 28 October 2006 23:32 (seventeen years ago) link
Monster's ringers: "You," "Circus Envy," "Bang and Blame."
― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Saturday, 28 October 2006 23:34 (seventeen years ago) link
Prediction: There will come a day when "The Fly" is your favorite song on Achtung Baby. This is what happens.
― hearditonthexico (rogermexico), Sunday, 29 October 2006 01:07 (seventeen years ago) link
i like the idea of r.e.m. fans across the country returning en masse a week after monster came out to sell their no-longer-wanted copies
― max (maxreax), Sunday, 29 October 2006 01:08 (seventeen years ago) link
― max (maxreax), Sunday, 29 October 2006 01:09 (seventeen years ago) link
Whereas REM was coming off their Joshua Tree.
― hearditonthexico (rogermexico), Sunday, 29 October 2006 01:15 (seventeen years ago) link
this broke my brain.
― the orchid and the wasp (Jody Beth Rosen), Sunday, 29 October 2006 01:20 (seventeen years ago) link
― max (maxreax), Sunday, 29 October 2006 01:29 (seventeen years ago) link
― gear (gear), Sunday, 29 October 2006 01:52 (seventeen years ago) link
This kind of leads in the direction of ultimately giving REM more long-term credit, insofar as, even though their albums have gotten less and less consistent, they've steadfastly refused to do a "they've returned to their classic sound!" record - even going so far as to release "Bad Day" just to prove that they could still do it if they wanted to. Whereas, after Pop, U2 seemed to realize they had taken the whole ironic, Euro, dancey, electronicafied, whatever thing, as far as they could...and then couldn't think of anything else so they just went for what they knew wouldn't fail to sell records on Beautiful Day or whatever it was called.
As for whether or not it was an "ironic" period, I'll grant that for REM it's a lot more debateable, but, seriously, PopMart?
― Doctor Casino (Doctor Casino), Sunday, 29 October 2006 03:20 (seventeen years ago) link
Best Album Since Blood On The Tracks
― hearditonthexico (rogermexico), Sunday, 29 October 2006 03:31 (seventeen years ago) link
-Bands that became popular in the 1980s
-Bands consisting only of white men
-Bands whose names lack lowercase letters
-Bands whose newest record is consistently "hailed as their best since the last one mattered"
-Bands whose entire discography is owned by my dad
-Bands who I listened to a lot in junior high
-Bands whose music features guitars and drums and a bass and vocals, either in concert or separately
-Bands who have been on the cover of Time magazine
― max (maxreax), Sunday, 29 October 2006 03:41 (seventeen years ago) link
totally off-topic, but i remeber seeing a feelies/rem show at the Felt Forum (lol, what a great name for a concert venue, amirite?) circa 1987. feelies didn't make much of an impression, rem were pretty good, but i had started to lose interest at that point (the Superman album) and then stipe did an ultra-diva pose late in the concert when some teens up front were pushing close to the stage - they walked off and never came back!! i guess they thought it was too dangerous/possibility of someone being crushed or something, but it easily could have been handled by security. that really ended the rem phase of my youth
― timmy tannin (pompous), Sunday, 29 October 2006 03:51 (seventeen years ago) link
Always seems important to register dissent re. this position. : D
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Sunday, 29 October 2006 03:59 (seventeen years ago) link
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Monday, 30 October 2006 14:03 (seventeen years ago) link
I wouldn't say Depeche Mode were approaching this sound by "Violator". "Songs Of Faith And Devotion" was very obviously an attempt to sound like "Achtung Baby" era U2, but "Violator" is more of a classic "dark" electropop album, which has also been the case with all of their post SOFAD-efforts.
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Monday, 30 October 2006 14:05 (seventeen years ago) link
monster for me is listenable, but fairly forgettable. it doesn't have a great deal of consistency or even a particular standout track (ok, maybe 'crush with eyeliner') to make me reflect on it when it's not playing. i've tried to revisit it a couple of times, but never seem to get more than a minimal kick out of it.
achtung baby is a strange record for me. it really does seem to be built around a few very good songs ('mysterious ways', 'one', 'acrobat', 'the fly') while the rest are either interesting ('love is blindness') or completely expendable ('so cruel', 'trying to throw your arms around the world'). the whole thing sounds great, and when the better tracks merge with the slick production, the record truly shines. really, a bizarre instance of an album where i treasure the highlights and tend to overlook the impact of the weaker tracks, perhaps because they're largely inoffensive and unmemorable. somehow it remains relatively untarnished and a landmark of early 90s rock.
― Charlie Howard (the sphinx), Monday, 30 October 2006 15:10 (seventeen years ago) link
― Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Monday, 30 October 2006 18:24 (seventeen years ago) link
This is OTM in every way. Add "Imitation Of Life" to "Bad Day", though. One of the great "eighties" R.E.M. songs.
― David A. (Davant), Monday, 30 October 2006 20:41 (seventeen years ago) link
(Ha, Just noticed the coincidence with the titles: "Beautiful Day" and "Bad Day" both being attempted -- and successful -- returns to form.)
― David A. (Davant), Monday, 30 October 2006 20:47 (seventeen years ago) link
― hearditonthexico (rogermexico), Monday, 30 October 2006 20:55 (seventeen years ago) link
― David A. (Davant), Monday, 30 October 2006 21:00 (seventeen years ago) link
And - and this is important - the last two U2 records are not returns to their 80s style. The U2 of the 80s were a mainly riff-based rock band, with The Edge's guitar playing the obvious centrepiece of everything, while the U2 of the oughties is more of a melodic pop band, heavily influenced by the classic songwriting style of the Britpop bands. I obviously prefer the latter, which is why the last two U2 albums have been my favourite albums by then ever.
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Monday, 30 October 2006 22:39 (seventeen years ago) link
I'm a Zooropa guy. Though I believe gear (obv. not Geir) will occasionally post in defense of Pop.
Geir, I agree that the last two records are not "returns to form," and I even think They've got some of Teh Edge's coolest playing, but what you're overlooking is that they're also boring and irrelevant. They're like the greatest Remy Zero records ever.
― hearditonthexico (rogermexico), Tuesday, 31 October 2006 00:48 (seventeen years ago) link
― gear (gear), Tuesday, 31 October 2006 00:51 (seventeen years ago) link
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Tuesday, 31 October 2006 09:50 (seventeen years ago) link
― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Tuesday, 31 October 2006 10:26 (seventeen years ago) link
― blackmail (blackmail.is.my.life), Thursday, 9 November 2006 14:39 (seventeen years ago) link
― pisces (piscesx), Thursday, 9 November 2006 14:52 (seventeen years ago) link
http://cache.kotaku.com/gaming/bono_takes_two.jpg
"...and y'know, I also think we need to sort out the environment because people are affected by that too and...what's this?... Alright, then, Geir has told me that I'm not supposed to talk about the environment. Just stick to poverty, yeah."
"By the way, did anyone buy that song we did with Green Day?... You did? Fookin' suckers!"
― wordy rappaport (EstieButtez1), Thursday, 9 November 2006 14:59 (seventeen years ago) link
"in the wake of the 9/11 attacks, for which their music was often used as an inspirational backdrop."
― hearditonthexico (rogermexico), Thursday, 9 November 2006 15:40 (seventeen years ago) link
― gear (gear), Thursday, 9 November 2006 18:58 (seventeen years ago) link
while the U2 of the oughties is more of a melodic pop band, heavily influenced by the classic songwriting style of the Britpop bands "Acrobat" by U2
― Doctor Casino, Sunday, 12 October 2008 14:39 (fifteen years ago) link
I'm still waiting for R.E.M. to go through a "let's go to Berlin and record" phase.
― Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Monday, October 30, 2006 10:24 AM (5 years ago)
It happened!
― timellison, Friday, 10 August 2012 21:11 (eleven years ago) link
This kind of leads in the direction of ultimately giving REM more long-term credit, insofar as, even though their albums have gotten less and less consistent, they've steadfastly refused to do a "they've returned to their classic sound!" record - even going so far as to release "Bad Day" just to prove that they could still do it if they wanted to
"Bad Day" wasn't a return to form, it WAS their old form, an outtake from Lifes Rich Pageant.
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Saturday, 11 August 2012 03:09 (eleven years ago) link
> they've steadfastly refused to do a "they've returned to their classic sound!" record
Every album after New Adventures was marketed as a "return to form"
― john. a resident of chicago., Saturday, 11 August 2012 03:10 (eleven years ago) link
"Star 69" just came on. This would have been a much better single than "Bang and Blame."
― Guayaquil (eephus!), Monday, 13 August 2012 18:04 (eleven years ago) link
I can't check to see if it was an official single but it did get a lot of airplay.
― a regina spektor is haunting europe (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 13 August 2012 18:05 (eleven years ago) link
it was a promotional single w/ no video but it was maybe the 3rd or 4th biggest radio hit off the album.
― PollopolicĂa (some dude), Monday, 13 August 2012 18:07 (eleven years ago) link