The Unassailable Miles Davis, or, To Know Him Is To Love Him

Message Bookmarked

Bookmark Removed

Now that Miles Davis 70s fusion work has been critically rehablitated (and then some), does it seem fair to say he is the only musical force loved by everyone who pays attention? Have you ever heard of anybody who likes jazz but doesn't like Miles Davis? At least one of his phases, anyway (even Crouch/Mars. like the early stuff). What is it about Miles that makes him so great? And does anyone want to offer thoughts on his 80s output?

― Mark, Wednesday, 15 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

I take it you didn't see Uncut magazine this month, in which Miles Davis was the sacred cow of the month. Went on about how much he got credit for others work and stuff, loathed his own race etc. I couldn't tell whether the writer was just playing devil's advocate or really believed it.

― Nick, Wednesday, 15 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Even UNCUT though didn't go as far as to say the records were bad, though - just that the records were good for reasons pretty much unrelated to Miles. I have no idea whether this theory holds any water or not NB and will continue to listen to my Davis albums with pleasure.

― Tom, Wednesday, 15 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Loathed his own race?? Didn't detect any of that while reading the autobiography!

As far as his 80's output, it's not his greatest work, but check out "Aura".

― Sean, Wednesday, 15 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

I don't like modern jazz. At all.

― Bill, Wednesday, 15 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

His last album Doo-bop, was an interesting trip into acid jazz .. i'll give him this , he never put out the same album twice

― scott, Wednesday, 15 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

What made Miles so great was that he didn't give a fuck.

― David, Wednesday, 15 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

i like some jazz. i have hated everything i've heard by miles davis, which includes kind of blue, bitches' brew, and in a silent way.

― sundar subramanian, Wednesday, 15 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Sundar - Out of curiosity, what is some jazz you do like? This might help me figure this one out.

Maybe Miles is so great because of what Scott said -- he never made the same record twice (this could be going a bit far, though -- those mid-50s Presige albums are all pretty similar. All very good, too.) If you like lyricism, you got the Presige records, if you like sophisitcated arrangements, there's Sketchs & Miles Ahead, if you like funk, there's On The Corner, etc. He's the Neil Young of the jazz world, only Miles was such a major talent he could do all these things well.

― Mark, Wednesday, 15 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

I have no idea what makes Miles so great, unless you wanted to pick it apart with all sort of musical theory, which I've never thought is any kind of barometer for capturing that special, etheral quality that makes someone "great" anyway. He's an avatar, to me; Miles dripped *music* from every pore. There are people like that out there - not many, mind you - where everything they do has a music and a poetry to it. He was a bastard, a junkie, and an abusive spouse and lover. This is not up for debate. But I know few great aritsts who *weren't* one of those things, sadly. And he's dead now anyway, so it's all just water under the bridge at this point. The 70s stuff was just as brutal and uncompromising in its way as any free jazz (and they certainly gained him no larger of an audience to call it sell out. He probably made more playing "My Funny Valeninte" then he ever would with "Theme From Jack Johnson.") And people forget what a really great fucking horn player he was; it wasn't just the compositions, the bands, the playing...it was everything. I'm moving dangerously close to gushing fanboy mode here, so I'm gonna cut it short. As for his 80s work, I can't comment because I've never heard it. I will say that if his previously reviled 70s work can be reformed, I'm sure the same is already underway for his 80s stuff.

― Jess, Thursday, 16 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Bill - why not?

Sundar - could you elaborate on that hatred a little, or are you just trying to play Devil's Advocate? I seem to remember a certain Kraftwerk thread in which you assumed the very same role... ;-)

― Clarke B., Thursday, 16 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

'Jack Johnson' aside, I've never been able to get into the 70s stuff, but the Williams-Hancock-Shorter Quintet - wow! Endless repeat plays for those ones.

― dave q, Thursday, 16 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

I'm with Jess, I have no idea why Miles Davis is so great. And I hope i'll never find out. What I do know is that his post-In A Silent Way albums never bore me, they always sound new, somehow, even if you've been playing them for 10 years.

Now: the Neil Young of jazz? I don't think so! That would mean he never changed his style ;)

― Omar, Thursday, 16 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Clarke - I think it's to do with the fact that what I've heard never has any tune and I was bought up on musicals/fred astaire films, which, if they featured jazz, had nice melodies. I'm not in any way opposed to experimentation, but I just won't listen to modern jazz as I've never heard any that I liked. It's the equivalent of only liking pictures cause they look 'nice', I suppose, no matter how much of a crappy daub they are.

Bill

― Bill, Thursday, 16 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Tom, they did slag off some of the records. Didn't they say 'Kind of Blue' set the blueprint for BBC2 incidental music of the worst kind or something?

― Nick, Thursday, 16 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

coltrane's interstellar space is my favourite jazz album. after that would probably come free jazz. i like other ornette coleman like "lonely woman" also. i like cecil taylor and some sun ra, though i don't know much about sun ra, and local free jazz group rake a lot.

free stuff aside, i love ed bickert's sound and playing, though he often works with lame musicians or plays on lame pieces. i even remember quite enjoying some cbc concerts by oliver jones and marian mcpartland, though i don't play them much. i've even liked some lenny breau, though again it's not something i play much and it was a long time ago that i liked it.

going back, i've liked things by dizzy gillespie, as well as duke ellington. some django reinhardt even - i think i just like guitarists. but i'll be honest - it's the free records that i pull out.

i've just been unable to listen to kind of blue without wanting to pass out by the third track or so. (outkast's aquemini, comparably, takes maybe six tracks. but it has shorter tracks, i think.) i'm not sure i can really elaborate much further without having the cd around to play. it just didn't grab or retain my interest. didn't seem like anything more than "pleasant," "tasteful," and "perfectly executed." my friend (who likes the album) once described it as "almost like ambient music," which goes a long way towards explaining things for me.

my dislike for bb and iasw comes partly from my distaste for john mclaughlin's noodling. and the laid-back wing-tip funk keyboards just aren't to my taste. i have no interest in herbie hancock or chick corea. i didn't think the rock side of md's jazz- rock fusions was cream-of-the-crop rock at all.

i don't think i quite hated round about midnight but i couldn't imagine wanting to hear it either.

clarke: what are you referring to? i really liked the mix, didn't care that much for radio-activity, liked some other things i'd heard from trans-europe express. i don't think i have ever said otherwise. outside of ilm, it has hardly been my experience that kraftwerk is so universally and uncritically acclaimed. do you think i pine away at night, secretly regretting that i sold radio-activity two years ago?

― sundar subramanian, Thursday, 16 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Sundar, you should certainly check out some of Miles' more "out there" stuff as well - _Dark Magus_ and _Get Up With It_ are two I'd strongly recommend. Worlds away from _Kind of Blue_ (though that was one of the first jazz albums I fell in love with).

... do you think i pine away at night, secretly regretting that i sold radio-activity two years ago?

Well I should certainly hope so!

― Clarke B., Friday, 17 August 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

9 years pass...

This is probably my favorite piece of music writing ever: http://www.ivy-style.com/the-warlord-of-the-weejuns.html

― dirty *plop* (The Reverend), Friday, 17 December 2010 14:10 (2 years ago) Permalink

All I’m trying to say, really, is that most boutique customers should be lined up before a firing squad at dawn and that there should be a minute of silence to thank God for the existence of people like Miles Davis

There is something beautiful about this sentence.

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 17 December 2010 15:20 (2 years ago) Permalink

1 year passes...

US Postal Service to issue Miles Davis stamp

And it's the cover of Jack Johnson!

― Let A Man Come In And Do The Cop Porn (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Thursday, 26 January 2012 18:49 (1 year ago) Permalink

nice!

― lag∞n affiliated (The Reverend), Thursday, 26 January 2012 22:19 (1 year ago) Permalink

I will buy these stamps!

― sleeve, Thursday, 26 January 2012 22:42 (1 year ago) Permalink

WTF challops shit was I on??

― EveningStar (Sund4r), Thursday, 26 January 2012 23:22 (1 year ago) Permalink

6 months pass...

Squeaky door sounds just like Bitches Brew.

― Choogle Image Search (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Friday, 17 August 2012 22:08 (9 months ago) Permalink

And I just saw Stanley Crouch run down there with a can of WD-40.

― Choogle Image Search (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Friday, 17 August 2012 22:09 (9 months ago) Permalink

http://tsutpen.blogspot.com/2012/08/the-gunslinger-guide-to-miles-davis-7.html

― Iago Galdston, Saturday, 18 August 2012 02:02 (9 months ago) Permalink

Always glad to be reminded of "The Warlord Of The Weejuns"

― Vagelis (The Reverend), Saturday, 18 August 2012 06:07 (9 months ago) Permalink

You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.