Is blues "dead"?

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Yes there are currently producing artists. But is it stagnant or thriving? Is there innovation? Are there hot young performers or is the pool drying up? Do the blues of today have anything to do with the blues of the 20s? The 50s? Is it just clapton unfolding on an "authentic" terrain? Is there continuity or was there a break and then a revival?

― Sterling Clover, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Blues musical signifier = guitar with naturally-overdriven tone (i.e. no George Lynch Krunch-Rock-Metal-Kill! pedal) playing pentatonic scale with lots of finger vibrato on flatted thirds and sevenths. Too many double-stops and its r'n'r (Chuck Berry). Blues musical signifier qualifier = can't sound like player learned this style in Guitar Institute of Technology, otherwise the non-musical signifier called into question. So no Jonny Lang, Kenny Wayne Shepherd or anybody Canadian. (Oh alright, the blind guy, as long as he stays away from George Lynch pedal. Actually, he sux, I'm just trying to be nice because he's blind.) (Ben Harper too, sounds untutored but still 'too good' if u know what I mean) Which leaves us with stoner rock as the Modern Blues in form & spirit. Strange, because Cream & Sab were NOT blues. They were 'blooze'. (Led Zep's 'blues' was unspeakable, except for 'Levee Breaks'.)The stuff they influenced IS blues though. Clear?

― tarden, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

It was alive last year when I saw R.L. Burnside (he was awesome!). But I don't know, I haven't personally checked its pulse lately.

― duane, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

(maybe it was the year before last actually)(or even as long as 3 years ago... it's all kind of a blur)

― duane, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Related question: Are R.L. and the whole Fat Possum crew, who are clearly r0x, overly marketed as "authentic" and if so does this in itself signal the larger cultural death of blues?

― Sterling Clover, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Yes, but R.L. has actually been around for decades, so if the blues rests on him, it doesn't have long to go.

― tarden, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Re Fat Possum - they are being marketed as 'authentic' blues, I think the Beck connection is emphasized alot - spoke to Cody Dickenson of the N.M. All-Stars and he actually said that Beck and Jon Spencer had 'really awesome chops', and a feel for the genre, and all the downtown stuff was just a way to sell it to the media - but then, I saw them and it seemed to be an authentic recreation of something else, namely second-tier 70s stadium rock (when they brought out a washboard it reminded me of Black Oak Arkansas, not the Depression). Maybe it's impossible to play the traditional blues anymore without summoning up all sorts of unpleasant musical associations, and if so, should that matter to the performers, and why or why not?

― tarden, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Sentence should be 'marketed as authentic blues, BUT the Beck connection emphasized', in case anyone thinks I think 'Mutations' is the first-ever blues album.

― tarden, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

'Mutations' = first-ever *authentic* blues album.

― mark s, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Are we talking about 2 Step Blues, UK Blues, or Intelligent Blues Music (IBM)?

That stuff is sooooo 1999.

― Momus, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Math-Blues!!

― mark s, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

You think that's amusing, see Dave Marsh's 'explanation' of the origins of house music, as he seems to think it comes from Pinetop Perkins.

― tarden, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

The blues was killed by its baby Oedipus-style. The 50s coffeehouse folk scene struck the first blow, then those English fuckers in the 60s (Yardbirds-Mayall et. al.) finished it off. That's when the blues mutated from African-American party music (no blues musician was worth a thing unless he could rock the house) to some kind of condescending idiot-savant cliche. Once the blues started to sell in big numbers to the white middle class, there was financial pressure to conform to the buying public's notions of what it all meant. Next thing you know you got the Blues Brothers.

R.L. Burnside is interesting because his style developed outside the blues mainstream, as happened frequently before blues was so narrowly defined. R.L. is telling surreal stories, cruising on one chord, making music you can dance to, etc. 12-bar baby-done-me-wrong is only part of his story.

― Mark, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

The days of the blues as a valid form of artistic expression are long gone, but as a MOR corporate thang (BB King, Olu Dara) or a hipster thang (Fat Possum) it's doing pretty well. The only band that are doing anything new with the whole idea of the blues are the North Mississippi Allstars--not very interesting on record, but definitely a band to see live. And they're good friends with Mr Burnside.

― adam, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Is blues the same as jazz, where connection to a great 'founding father' - normally Charlie Parker - is taken to be a sign of a continuing tradition? Now that John Lee Hooker is a goner, are there any surviving bluesmen who can trace their heritage back to Robert Johnson?

― Andrew L, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

i don't know , is robt jr lockwood still alive?

― duane, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

I was raised to hate th e blues. Uncles and brothers forced it on me. DAmn predictable music. I like HOwlin WOlf though cause its weird.

― Mike Hanle y, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Yes, alive and well in cleveland ohio. He plays out infrequently. I believe he just put a record on Telarc (known for their classical recordings).

― Steven James, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

If you read nothing but Buddy Seigel's astoundingly annoying pronouncements out here in the OC Weekly, you'd think it was the only general musical form going. He is WRONG.

― Ned Raggett, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Doesn't anyone else dig Kelly Joe Phelps? He's entertaining, if nothing else.

― Cryosmurf, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

I thought blues was dead, but on a recent walk through the ghetto of West Oakland, I came upon a bar called the A&C Club on a sunday afternoon. Inside was a rippin' blues band, with crappy Peavey amps and cheap Squier guitars. They wore cowboy hats and satin shirts, invited people to come up and sing... and they they invited a guy called Preacher Man on the floor, who tap-danced with a stack of folding metal chairs on his head. I got pickpocketed by an old man in his seventies wearing a leisure suit. I was drunk and walked home broke and wallet- less. So I guess I'll say "yes, the blues lives."

― Andy, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

What about Kid Rock/Unkle Kracker/Staind type nu-metal blues? That's like the most popular music around these days. If that doesn't count then blues died in the early fifties, which I don't think it did.

― Kris, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Just listening to a Loren Mazzacane Connors alb - blues living on in art-rock form (Fahey of course the other urgent and key example) and doing more to preserve the 'heritage' than dull but faithful replicators like Kelly Jo Phelps?

― Andrew L, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Unkle Kracker seemed more country, and Kid Rock more ballad and Staind more defuzzed alternative. Judging by harmonics, chord changes, and suchforth.

― Sterling Clover, Wednesday, 18 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

The blues didn't die so much as rock ate it alive.

― Dave M., Thursday, 19 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

What would a music called "the yellows" sound like?

― phil, Thursday, 19 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Endless amounts of Coldplays as far as the eye can see, that's what. Feel sick yet?

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 20 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Andrew L. - Loren Mazzacane Connors - seeing as that had a question mark after it I will say YES.

― duane, Sunday, 22 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

Blues will live in her Children ( Rock, Gospel and Country )

― anthony, Sunday, 22 July 2001 00:00 (11 years ago) Permalink

1 year passes...

Blues is more alive than punk rock.
You'll never see Shania Twain wearing a Fred McDowell t-shirt.

― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Wednesday, 22 January 2003 19:00 (10 years ago) Permalink

you can't make this stuff up, people...

Calendar No. 567
107th CONGRESS
2d Session
S. RES. 316
Designating the year beginning February 1, 2003, as the ‘Year of the Blues’.
IN THE SENATE OF THE UNITED STATES

August 1, 2002
Mrs. LINCOLN (for herself, Mr. COCHRAN, Mr. THOMPSON, Mr. FRIST, Ms. CANTWELL, and Mrs. MURRAY) submitted the following resolution; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary

September 5, 2002
Reported by Mr. LEAHY, without amendment

RESOLUTION

Designating the year beginning February 1, 2003, as the ‘Year of the Blues’.

Whereas blues music is the most influential form of American roots music, with its impact heard around the world in rock and roll, jazz, rhythm and blues, country, and even classical music;

Whereas the blues is a national historic treasure, which needs to be preserved, studied, and documented for future generations;

Whereas the blues is an important documentation of African-American culture in the twentieth century;

Whereas the various forms of the blues document twentieth-century American history during the Great Depression and in the areas of race relations, pop culture, and the migration of the United States from a rural, agricultural society to an urban, industrialized Nation;

Whereas the blues is the most celebrated form of American roots music, with hundreds of festivals held and millions of new or reissued blues albums released each year in the United States;

Whereas the blues and blues musicians from the United States, whether old or new, male or female, are recognized and revered worldwide as unique and important ambassadors of the United States and its music;

Whereas it is important to educate the young people of the United States to understand that the music that they listen to today has its roots and traditions in the blues;

Whereas there are many living legends of the blues in the United States who need to be recognized and to have their story captured and preserved for future generations; and

Whereas the year 2003 is the centennial anniversary of when W.C. Handy, a classically-trained musician, heard the blues for the first time, in a train station in Mississippi, thus enabling him to compose the first blues music to distribute throughout the United States, which led to him being named ‘Father of the Blues’: Now, therefore, be it

Resolved, That the Senate—
designates the year beginning February 1, 2003, as the ‘Year of the Blues’; and

requests that the President issue a proclamation calling on the people of the United States to observe the ‘Year of the Blues’ with appropriate ceremonies, activities, and educational programs.

― david day (winslow), Wednesday, 22 January 2003 19:14 (10 years ago) Permalink

no surprise Trent Lott didn't sponsor it.

― hstencil, Wednesday, 22 January 2003 19:24 (10 years ago) Permalink

2 years pass...

Blues is a genre that I've lost all interest in, aside from the old stuff. There was a time I was constantly trying to check into newer blues artists, but after one-too-many overproduced Alligator records and disappointing comeback efforts, I concluded it was on life support at the very least.

Are there any great blues artists who are right now at the top of their game?

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Tuesday, 12 April 2005 21:21 (8 years ago) Permalink

Can't believe the inanity of my post. Don't have a clue what I was talking about. I must have been stoned or something. Carry on.

― Mark (MarkR), Tuesday, 12 April 2005 21:50 (8 years ago) Permalink

Oh, I can believe it.

― Stormy Davis (diamond), Tuesday, 12 April 2005 22:52 (8 years ago) Permalink

I guess I was innovating blues back then early 90s. I was in an Amiga group with another guy who loved blues and hated house music. Not too keen on either genre, I still decided to make a 12 bar blues with a house been just to piss him off. Too bad I didn't influence anybody though ;)

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Tuesday, 12 April 2005 23:02 (8 years ago) Permalink

That is house beat, not house been

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Tuesday, 12 April 2005 23:02 (8 years ago) Permalink

I generally sidle away from people who want to talk about "blues." Like when they ask me, who's your favorite blues artist, I always say "Elmore James." Is he the greatest or most profound? No, but he's the one I enjoy most--the good humor mixed with desperation, the casualness of it all mixed with some kind of real passion. Howlin' Wolf was better, he's actually my favorite artist ever, almost--the only artist of the whole rock era I implicitly believe in, more even than Dylan or James Brown, or Robin Gibb...

Anyway, I think it's been dead since the '60s, since the first English guy was really elated he'd worked out how to play "San-Ho-Zay" on the guitar. I never bought into the Fat Possum/Hill Country boogie craze, there are some nice moments but overall it's about on the level on Jon Spencer and his Blooze Explosion. I never understood how intelligent people could say about CeDell Davis (who is a good singer and who has had his moments on record), for example, was "harmolodic" and "extending the blues" just because he fretted the guitar with his butter knife and did stumble-bum versions of songs like "Green Onions" down in Oxford. I never understood why people go nuts over Buddy Guy, who is really good, but ignore Snooks Eaglin, a vastly superior guitarist. Because he's from New Orleans and does a wide range of material, I guess, which isn't "blues." Anyway, it's the whole obsession over guitar-playing itself that deformed blues forty years ago, read those pieces from back then and it's all about who played the best blues licks, and I think that's a total misreading of what the whole thing was about. When I was growing up, I really thought that B.B., Freddie and Albert King were related or the same person...that doesn't even bring into account Saunders King, who recorded in the '40s. I think that no one's ever made sense out of the history of blues or jazz, it's constant revisionism, and it'll take another hundred years to get a bead on it...the recent efforts to integrate the early history of blues, etc., as it emerged out of minstrelsy are probably a big first step. Very difficult to see the whole picture, and I'm just as confused about it as anyone else...

― edd s hurt (ddduncan), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 01:21 (8 years ago) Permalink

The best blues artist I've seen live over the past 15 years or so was William Clarke, who was an astonishing harmonica player. He could practically summon an entire horn section from that instrument. He died in 1996, only about a month after I saw him play in Ithaca, NY. Fantastic show.

The problem with many popular blues artists is that it's about their chops more than their songwriting. Buddy Guy is a fantastic guitar player, but most of his records since his early-'90s comeback were pure wankery. And all-too-often I've seen blues musicians play a few cuts featured in The Blues Brothers as a way to win over their audience. Is "Sweet Home Chicago" a good song? Maybe, but I sure as hell don't ever want to hear it again.

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 05:14 (8 years ago) Permalink

Dunno if blues is dead or not, and don't much care. One thing that should die, however, is present-day "authentic" purist delta blues, as practiced (loaded word) by Eric Clapton and the rest of those jerks. Don't they realize that Robert Johnson and Charley Patton and the rest of 'em played beat-up acoustics because they had no electricity? (And couldn't afford electric instruments anyway.) At the very least, no-one born after 1930 should attempt it. But I certainly approve of the Sharrocks, the Beefhearts, the "Blood" Ulmers and anyone else who can take Delta blues and transform it into something new and less predictable.

― Myonga Von Bontee (Myonga Von Bontee), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 08:43 (8 years ago) Permalink

One thing that should die, however, is present-day "authentic" purist delta blues, as practiced (loaded word) by Eric Clapton and the rest of those jerks.

Eric Clapton is mainly attempting to be Phil Collins lately. Been some time since he was a blueman.

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 10:00 (8 years ago) Permalink

I just saw EC on TV playing blues, with Hubert Sumlin and others. His whole existence is still founded on him playing the blues.

― edd s hurt (ddduncan), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 13:18 (8 years ago) Permalink

I am very aware of that. Kind of corny, then, that his album output lately has had nothing to do with blues.

― Geir Hongro (GeirHong), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 13:28 (8 years ago) Permalink

I generally sidle away from people who want to talk about "blues."
A friend of mine and I have a saying about this: You know you're in trouble when someone tells you "I love the blues!"

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 13:36 (8 years ago) Permalink

or maybe I should have said "Blueshammer to thread!"

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 13:38 (8 years ago) Permalink

"I never understood why people go nuts over Buddy Guy, who is really good, but ignore Snooks Eaglin, a vastly superior guitarist."

Buddy Guy played with Muddy Waters and recorded at Chess. I think it is the same for many jazz artists, if they have a background playing with Miles or some other old master, I think they find it a whole lot easier to get gigs and record deals as their careers are directly tied into the "History" of the music.

― earlnash, Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:00 (8 years ago) Permalink

"I think that no one's ever made sense out of the history of blues or jazz, it's constant revisionism, and it'll take another hundred years to get a bead on it...the recent efforts to integrate the early history of blues, etc., as it emerged out of minstrelsy are probably a big first step."

eddie have you read 'blues people' by leroi jones? it had a few points on this and the relation on blues/jazz though I'm not sure how it compares with other stories on the blues as I've mostly read stuff on ilx abt it and that's it.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:04 (8 years ago) Permalink

if they have a background playing with Miles
This is so true. And, based on anecdotal evidence, if fans of the type you're describing go to a show, the guy can phone it in without fear of reprisal, because they will never call him on it.

the history of blues or jazz
About five minutes after reading a history of music book I think I understand how it all fits together, but about ten minutes later I'm confused again.

― Ken L (Ken L), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:08 (8 years ago) Permalink

one other thing is that if blues is a felling then it can mutate...a few weeks ago I was listening to a vinko glokobar LP (avant-garde thrombonist) and there was a bark, a snoty growl to his playing that reminded me of howling wolf. certain qualities are adapted, or find their way (conciously or otherwise) to completely diff records (in the formal sense).

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 13 April 2005 14:19 (8 years ago) Permalink

3 years pass...

waited all these years to see video of Jimmy Reed, whose music changed my life when I was 13...he does not disappoint

― J0hn D., Friday, 23 January 2009 01:04 (4 years ago) Permalink

2 years pass...

Just shy of his 96th birthday, Honeyboy Edwards just passed.

http://www.davidhoneyboyedwards.com/

― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 30 August 2011 15:05 (1 year ago) Permalink

I don't have any recorded music of his but liked him when I saw him live last year.

― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 30 August 2011 16:12 (1 year ago) Permalink

rip!

― tylerw, Tuesday, 30 August 2011 16:49 (1 year ago) Permalink

5 months pass...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/at-white-house-bb-king-and-mick-jagger-among-others-to-play-the-blues/2012/02/21/gIQAlyHyRR_story.html

Set List:
1. “Let the Good Times Roll” (Ensemble)
2. “The Thrill Is Gone” (B.B King)
3. “St. James Infirmary” (Trombone Shorty)
4. “Let Me Love You Baby” (Buddy Guy, Jeff Beck)
5. “Brush With The Blues” instrumental (Jeff Beck)
6. “I Can’t Turn You Loose” (Mick Jagger)
7. “Commit A Crime” (Mick Jagger, Jeff Beck)
8. “Miss You” (Mick Jagger, Shemekia Copeland, and Susan Tedeschi)
9. “Beat Up Guitar” (Shemekia Copeland, Gary Clark, Jr.)
10. “Catfish Blues” (Gary Clark, Jr.)
11. “In The Evening (When The Sun Goes Down)” (Gary Clark, Jr.)
12. “Henry” ( Keb’ Mo’)
13. “I’d Rather Go Blind” (Susan Tedeschi, Derek Trucks, Warren Haynes)
14. “Five Long years” (Buddy Guy, Jeff Beck, Gary Clark, Mick Jagger)
15. “Sweet Home Chicago” (Ensemble)

PBS is showing this Monday February 27th I think

― curmudgeon, Wednesday, 22 February 2012 17:05 (1 year ago) Permalink

6 months pass...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=7ZuDcrurzBQ

― one dis leads to another (ian), Wednesday, 5 September 2012 00:52 (8 months ago) Permalink

Really wish I could go to his NYC performances. Someone better record them shits. Ahem, Ian, cough cough

― If Assholes Could Fly This Place Would Be An Airport, Wednesday, 5 September 2012 01:26 (8 months ago) Permalink

i don't have anything to record them with! maybe helen has a tape recorder or something.

― one dis leads to another (ian), Wednesday, 5 September 2012 13:29 (8 months ago) Permalink

Ah, don't sweat it, betcha Ad@m L0re will record it somehow. I really, really wish I could be in NYC for these shows. Dude is awesome. You ever see the clips of him in M For Mississippi?

― If Assholes Could Fly This Place Would Be An Airport, Wednesday, 5 September 2012 23:06 (8 months ago) Permalink

i have only seen some clips of his house parties on youtube -- i dunno if that's the same material or not. he is great tho. and yeah, i bet adam will record.. adam is a great dude.

― one dis leads to another (ian), Wednesday, 5 September 2012 23:16 (8 months ago) Permalink

We've never met but we correspond quite a bit via email - the very existence of his distro answers this thread's question with a resounding "NO"

― If Assholes Could Fly This Place Would Be An Airport, Wednesday, 5 September 2012 23:27 (8 months ago) Permalink

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