isnt this TEEN GIRL CULTURE & why isnt it getting full writeups in natl publications??
i'd say that the 2nd most obvious reason is that it's familiar music that succeeds according to the established rules of rap as a genre. there's nothing terribly novel about it.
don't want to get into the 1st most obvious reason, as i don't think it would benefit the thread.
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:38 (twelve years ago) link
benefit the thread? come on, don't break your streak now.
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:40 (twelve years ago) link
Ok, so she's in college and at least 16. Glad to hear that young kids are making music now. I'll send a letter to Alex Chilton in his grave to let him know.
― dlp9001, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:40 (twelve years ago) link
so tell me, if its no surprise then why do you keep saying dumb shit about "teen culture"
that we can identify cultural groups doesn't mean they're unitary. and i think that, though neither is homogeneous, it would be hard to find two cultural groups in america with less in common, aesthetically and philosophically, than adult male music critics and teenage girls.
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:40 (twelve years ago) link
now who's the 'rap expert'
― man down (D-40), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:41 (twelve years ago) link
hey, look: i've been civil and positive all the way through. if you've got something to say, then say it. i'm not pushing for any kind of clusterfuck here.
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:42 (twelve years ago) link
sometimes i wish an ilxor would be like: 'i don't understand how anything works, i don't know why anyone including me really likes anything, the void is infinite and stretches before me i'm afraid" cause that would be preferable to this exchange
― Mordy, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:42 (twelve years ago) link
jeez mordy step away from the computer already
xp
ok, here's what i have to say: you keep making ~BIG PRONOUNCEMENTS~ about subjects like ~TEENAGE GIRL CULTURE~ based on ideation rather than any actual experience and iirc i called you out about this on another thread
i mean sorry if you don't like it but getting called on your bullshit is rarely a pleasant experience
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:43 (twelve years ago) link
the other artists brought up in this thread and youtube'd in this thread to suggest "this, on the other hand, is good" don't do anything of the same personal coming of age diary sort, and whether you think kp is complete dog shit or not no critics here seem capable of asking or answering why this particular person gets more appreciation than other teenage white blog music girls who don't, like all they can say is "this is embarassing", "this is a fashion mag CONSPIRACY", there's no critical thought into it, no willingness to argue about the music itself, the message, the point of view this person is coming from, only generalized bullshit about teen culture drawn from their own past. embarassing.
― abcfsk, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:44 (twelve years ago) link
don't claim any expertise. as i see it, sasha go hard's approach is much more in line with the loosely defined, quality-defining "rules" of rap as a genre than KP's. if i'm wrong in that, let me know.
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:44 (twelve years ago) link
i think whats novel abt her was touched upon upthread.
reporting believably from the frontlines of teenhood while being smart enough to reflect and joke about it in a genuinely funny and touching way
also idk y old ppl (including myself in this) cannot relate, the themes are p universal adolescence stuff & uncertainty & playfulness just updated 2 include the weirdness of the internet also
― johnny crunch, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:45 (twelve years ago) link
you contenderizer i don't see what's so civil about implying a bunch of posters are secretly sexist paedophiles because they think this girl is bullshit
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:46 (twelve years ago) link
there's no critical thought into it, no willingness to argue about the music itself, the message, the point of view this person is coming from, only generalized bullshit about teen culture drawn from their own past. embarassing.
ironically enough that's pretty much how the positive kudos for kitty pryde read too
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:47 (twelve years ago) link
abcfsk otm
― johnny crunch, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:47 (twelve years ago) link
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Saturday, May 12, 2012 7:44 PM (36 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
this is bc of your own white privilege & constant justification of the status quo of discourse as if its a naturally occurring thing instead of the result of ppl's power relations etc.
you're not wrong about sasha per se, you're wrong about KP being some radical break w/ (a different) tradition. she raps like paul barman over the same beats main attrakionz have been using to banal wallpaper smedium internet success.
xxp 'the frontlines of teenhood' gtfo
― man down (D-40), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:48 (twelve years ago) link
― johnny crunch, Saturday, May 12, 2012 7:45 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
they cant relate bc its poorly executed
― man down (D-40), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:49 (twelve years ago) link
don't do anything of the same personal coming of age diary
ah yes, the in situ bildungsroman, highest form of art
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:49 (twelve years ago) link
you keep making ~BIG PRONOUNCEMENTS~ about subjects like ~TEENAGE GIRL CULTURE~ based on ideation rather than any actual experience and iirc i called you out about this on another thread
i haven't really made any big pronouncements about anything, though. i merely suggested that the POV articulated in this music might be alienating to adult male music critics due to simple cultural distance. you don't know anything about where i'm coming from, what i know or don't. and in that other thread, you did exactly the same thing: arrogantly proclaimed the superiority of your understanding without even trying to engage with what i was saying (before dramatically storming out).
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:50 (twelve years ago) link
― man down (D-40), Saturday, May 12, 2012 5:48 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
the first part of that is horseshit, and unless you can support it with stuff that i've said in this thread, it's contemptible that you'd feel the need to drag it in.
the second part i disagree with. i think it was easy for adult critics (mostly dudes) to relate to and appreciate paul barman's schtick. much less so kitty pryde's.
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:52 (twelve years ago) link
"merely"? you sure you don't mean "feebly"?
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:54 (twelve years ago) link
the paul barman comparison is abt her musical approach. there's nothing novel about her style that isn't also novel about sasha's in a different context
― man down (D-40), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:54 (twelve years ago) link
i haven't really made any big pronouncements about anything, though. i merely suggested that the POV articulated in this music might be alienating to adult male music critics due to simple cultural distance.
haha! i'm such a simpleton! i don't understand "simple cultural distance" between "my culture" and "teen culture".
how arrogant to assume that since i work day in and day out with teenagers i might know a thing or two about what they like or dislike or whether kitty pride "speaks for them"!
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:55 (twelve years ago) link
― the late great, Saturday, May 12, 2012 5:46 PM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
you misread something. i casually (jokingly) agreed that adult male fans of KP were creepier than the haters. in response to whiney calling her fans "paedo manchildren". otoh, i do suspect that knee-jerk sexism does play into the contempt that's habitually displayed by men for specifically female culture, and this is no exception.
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:56 (twelve years ago) link
contenderizer lacks so much self awareness that he cant see how his 'simple cultural distance' might actual inform his bias about the novelty of KP vs Sasha
― man down (D-40), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:57 (twelve years ago) link
oh i see it was a joke, what an idiot i am!
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:57 (twelve years ago) link
― the late great, Saturday, May 12, 2012 5:55 PM (42 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
you're personalizing this in a very strange way. i haven't said anything about you specifically.
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:57 (twelve years ago) link
hahaha "female culture" i should ask my mom about kitty pryde tomorrow, maybe SHE can break it down for me
actually, dickhead, you specifically said i was arrogant
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:58 (twelve years ago) link
no, what you missed was that i wasn't calling the haters paedophiles
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:58 (twelve years ago) link
Ayo contendo just fyi man you don't have deeply contemplate every single thing on the internet
― Bandersnatch Cumberbund (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:58 (twelve years ago) link
oh whoops i missed it!
WTF is wrong with you? do you have some sort of short-term amnesia when you post to the internet?
i was referring primarily to your behavior in the other thread, something you brought up
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:59 (twelve years ago) link
once again the subtleties of your argument are beyond my simple mind
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 00:59 (twelve years ago) link
oh i see you weren't referring to me, you were referring to my behavior in the other thread
― the late great, Saturday, May 12, 2012 5:57 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
so you don't think guys often shit on things for being too "girly", or for "chicks" or w/e?
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:00 (twelve years ago) link
well for starters a lot more of it actually quotes lyrics and attempts some contextualizing and appraisal of what's being said. that's a big advantage right there
your point? this isn't a value judgement. people post random alternatives and go "why isn't this completely different product awarded the same exact attention?". I think before you ask those questions is the right time to actually check out what you're talking about. I mean, we've got people actually using the beats as an example of why this is redundant.
other than that I really hope most of these people aren't still in this thread when I wake up tomorrow
― abcfsk, Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:01 (twelve years ago) link
my point is that you don't automatically score points for writing "a personal coming of age story" if you do it in a wack way
i think that, though neither is homogeneous, it would be hard to find two cultural groups in america with less in common, aesthetically and philosophically, than adult male music critics and teenage girls
nope no big pronouncements here
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:02 (twelve years ago) link
FINALLY some common ground on this thread
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:03 (twelve years ago) link
listening to everything teenagers tell you in a transparent effort to appear down is not the wave
― man down (D-40), Saturday, May 12, 2012 7:16 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark
my world of young ppl is being shattered over here
― some dude, Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:04 (twelve years ago) link
― the late great, Saturday, May 12, 2012 5:59 PM (58 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
sigh. you got all heated and seemed to imply that i was telling you how to feel about "teen culture". i wasn't. how you feel is your business. that's the strange personalization i was referring to.
honestly, if the worst thing i've said about your behavior itt is that it's been "arrogant", then i've been remarkably civil, given the provocation...
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:05 (twelve years ago) link
thats a pretty misleading reference 2 what 'my world of young ppl' was about xp
― man down (D-40), Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:05 (twelve years ago) link
yeah, that's a pronouncement. don't see it as terribly big or remarkable, but perhaps we differ there. okay...
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:06 (twelve years ago) link
contenderizer is it possible that your distance from teen female culture could be causing you to OVERRATE the significance of this song?
― man down (D-40), Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:06 (twelve years ago) link
― man down (D-40), Saturday, May 12, 2012 5:57 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
no, i understand the way my cultural positioning affects my perception. but i disagree that my cultural positioning invalidates my perception.
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:07 (twelve years ago) link
you know contendo, some people find condescension a lot more provocative than swearing, which is probably why people hate on you
no, certainly not people like j0rdan or d-40 or rev or whoever who are all over the r&b threads
― the late great, Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:07 (twelve years ago) link
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Saturday, May 12, 2012 8:07 PM (16 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
you dont realize this completely undermines your argument about us hating on this song
― man down (D-40), Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:09 (twelve years ago) link
― man down (D-40), Saturday, May 12, 2012 6:06 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
yeah, definitely! that's part of what i meant when i talked earlier about it seeming to exist on a different planet. i don't necessarily think it's all that significant, fwiw. just strikingly novel.
― 10. “Pour Some Sugar On Me” – Tom Cruise (contenderizer), Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:09 (twelve years ago) link
― man down (D-40), Saturday, May 12, 2012 6:09 PM (10 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
no, because i'm not saying that you're wrong to hate it. i'm just saying that there might be equally good reasons to like it.
Enough people seem annoyed and angry to maybe get one of these songs into the ilx top 77. I'll try
― abcfsk, Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:10 (twelve years ago) link
― man down (D-40), Saturday, May 12, 2012 9:05 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark
that's honestly pretty much always how i had read your world of young ppl posts, though, dude. obviously it's not remotely the same situation but that's how a lot of your "i know lots of young women who really love nicki minaj" stuff came off to me.
― some dude, Sunday, 13 May 2012 01:11 (twelve years ago) link