money quote on the issue from one of the producer dudes during my interview: "i'm pretty sure everyone in this room has had sex with a guy."
(then he paused and said something like "and a girl", at which the singers made little protesting noises)
― lex pretend, Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:36 (twelve years ago) link
http://i.imgur.com/HpmFc.jpg
― ( •ิ.•ั) (gr8080), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:37 (twelve years ago) link
lol plax otm re: old traxx records
― ( •ิ.•ั) (gr8080), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:38 (twelve years ago) link
ha that's great xxp
― dutty whiney (The Reverend), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:39 (twelve years ago) link
afraid my homosploitation comment distracted from the main thrust (nh) of what i was saying
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:40 (twelve years ago) link
please don't say something about real house music
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:41 (twelve years ago) link
Yeah, it's news to me that the other two guys aren't gay. If there's one problem with this album - and I only have one problem with it - it's that there isn't quite enough of Cedric on it.
I do understand what Deej is saying but it's tedious enough having to suffer the True Kvlt vs. hipster or authentic vs. cynical arguments in black metal and hardcore without having them applied to house music - where the standard response to dance music should be who gives a fuck as long as it's good to dance to and it sounds great. I mean, what would differentiate authentic camp from untruthful camp in the first place?
― Rebekah Brooks Hardsonned My Hamster (Doran), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:43 (twelve years ago) link
artificial artifice
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:44 (twelve years ago) link
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:41 (4 minutes ago) Permalink
i didnt. are you reading what im posting at all?
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:46 (twelve years ago) link
my concern is that the cynicism w/ which they appropriate the past too often on this record (although not exclusively) expects the signifyers of past dance hits to do most of the work, which means they dont worry about songwriting / track construction. its too much of a game of 'remember this 90s house trick??' + frankly a somewhat weird homosploitation vibe for two straight producers (i.e. a track called "manhooker" and a BUILDING IS LIKE A COCK cover art) + general laziness
can i flip this question and ask, what are these guys bringing to the table that old songs dont already have? they dont sound very reverent at all, that i agree with.
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, August 3, 2011 6:19 PM (27 minutes ago) Bookmark
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:47 (twelve years ago) link
thread needs moonship journey to baja (nb he could entirely disagree w/ me)
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:49 (twelve years ago) link
you are the one introducing phrases like camp revivalism and pastiche so
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:51 (twelve years ago) link
pastiche is a style not a criticism. 'reckless' is pastiche too and i love that song
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:54 (twelve years ago) link
pas·tiche (p-stsh, pä-)n.1. A dramatic, literary, or musical piece openly imitating the previous works of other artists, often with satirical intent.2. A pasticcio of incongruous parts; a hodgepodge: "In . . . a city of splendid Victorian architecture . . . there is a rather pointless pastiche of Dickensian London down on the waterfront" (Economist).
the choice of pastiche DIRECTLY INVOKES the binary between the real and copy. seriously use words you understand.
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 18:57 (twelve years ago) link
by saying pastiche you strongly imply that rather than operating *in the tradition of* a particular genre that they are imitating the signifiers of that genre.
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:01 (twelve years ago) link
they are doing lol camp pastiches of classic house. i have no idea how i could have read real v fake into that jesus christ let me wipe these spectacles
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:02 (twelve years ago) link
1. A dramatic, literary, or musical piece openly imitating the previous works of other artists, often with satirical intent.
where does this say anything about real vs. copy? imo this music is openly imitating previous works of other artists
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:03 (twelve years ago) link
seriously use dictionaries you understand
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:04 (twelve years ago) link
ok you're an idiot
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:04 (twelve years ago) link
you seem to have confused things; the problem w/ 'real' vs 'fake' is when someone implies real is inherently better . thats not what im doing here. this is house music made up of lots of different notably 'house'-associated ideas/sounds. that makes it a 'pastiche.' there is no judgement of quality there
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:06 (twelve years ago) link
im·i·ta·tion (m-tshn)n.1. The act or an instance of imitating.2. Something derived or copied from an original.3. Musica. Repetition of a phrase or melody often with variations in key, rhythm, and voice.b. Repetition of a theme in another voice such that each part con
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:06 (twelve years ago) link
whats your point
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:07 (twelve years ago) link
lol l8r
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:08 (twelve years ago) link
i don't see the camp in azari & III's music.
― jed_, Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:08 (twelve years ago) link
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, August 3, 2011 7:08 PM (53 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
lol grow up
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:10 (twelve years ago) link
You've done this whole using words that generally carry negative connotations but insisting you are using them in a neutral way while using them to slag something off routine before.
― dutty whiney (The Reverend), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:10 (twelve years ago) link
― dutty whiney (The Reverend), Wednesday, August 3, 2011 7:10 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
is that really what im doing? 'pastiche' never means something positive? im slagging off 'reckless,' a pastiche & one of my 5 favorite songs of last year? cmon rev
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:16 (twelve years ago) link
all pastiche means is made up of older parts of songs! thats it!
so. you're criticising them. using words that are synonymous with real v fake. but claiming that because those words don't necessarily carry negative connotations (that's true! well done!) that I am misreading you somehow in saying that *those words are synonymous with real v fake.* I will grow up, but i'd rather do it getting ice-cream than having a pointless circular argument with you as words magically empty themselves of meaning as soon as you use them.
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:17 (twelve years ago) link
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, August 3, 2011 7:17 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
pastiche is not synonymous with real vs. fake
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:20 (twelve years ago) link
∞
― ℗⎣▲✘ (ico), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:21 (twelve years ago) link
I'm not criticizing azari for being "fake" when compared to "real" house, which is what youre accusing me of, right? I'm not doing that at all. Its simply untrue. Saying that they make 80s/90s dance pastiche is a simple descrption of what they do.
The value judgement is that on the songs I don't like, they arent good enough songwriters or track constructors to bring these elements together into great songs; theres a sort of wishful thinking that hopefully if you pile enough signifyers together ppl will enjoy it simply as a memory exercise in nostalgia
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:29 (twelve years ago) link
I'm actually really interested in heating from people who really like this lp what youthink it is that makes it seem fresh.even with the songs I do like, I've had trouble articulating what pushed this ahead of rote revivalism. Theres definitely an irreverence here for one thing
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:36 (twelve years ago) link
Which is part of where the chromeo comparison came from
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:37 (twelve years ago) link
I'm actually really interested in heating from people
lol freudian slip
― ( •ิ.•ั) (gr8080), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:45 (twelve years ago) link
Swypian slip
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 19:49 (twelve years ago) link
For me it would have to sound very like one particular band/producer or label from a certain period for it to be a problem. If, say, it sounded exactly like Virgo IV or Inner City then I probably wouldn't like it but it casts a far wider net than that and gives it all a bit of a reboot to boot. The time frame it covers is too wide for it to be pastiche and there's simply something of recombinant brilliance about it for me.
― Death To False Camp (Doran), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 20:13 (twelve years ago) link
i don't see the camp in azari & III's music.― jed_, Wednesday, August 3, 2011 7:08 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― jed_, Wednesday, August 3, 2011 7:08 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― Dark Noises from the Eurozone (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 20:18 (twelve years ago) link
camp is more in their videos i think
― J0rdan S., Wednesday, 3 August 2011 20:20 (twelve years ago) link
threads that make u wish Carles posted to ilx
― ( •ิ.•ั) (gr8080), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 20:21 (twelve years ago) link
The groups presentation certainly dabbles in it. I do find "hungry for the power" to work from in that way in particular, the theatricality of it certainly.
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 20:25 (twelve years ago) link
they are megacamp live
Which is certainly not something I could say about Chromeo.
I would btw! They just have shallow hearts and souls.
― generous loller at dollies (sic), Wednesday, 3 August 2011 23:36 (twelve years ago) link
I like chromeo btw. The diss was that it was like their first album rather than their 2nd
I'm softening on the first half of this lp
― Gatsby was a success, in the end, wasn't he? (D-40), Thursday, 4 August 2011 00:24 (twelve years ago) link
Yeah, this is avery very good albumMaybe not top 20 for this year but close and growingon me
― I'm a nerd and nerdy things happened (forksclovetofu), Thursday, 4 August 2011 01:19 (twelve years ago) link
I wish this album was more Reckless With Your Love and less Hungry For The Power. I can sort of appreciate it and all that but for some reason it mostly just leaves me cold.
― Matt DC, Thursday, 4 August 2011 10:54 (twelve years ago) link
Maybe it's a drug/club of yore Pavlovian reaction thing. When I hear Indigo and Tunnel Vision, I feel like there's a jet engine going off in my head.
― Death To False Camp (Doran), Thursday, 4 August 2011 11:13 (twelve years ago) link
That's the weird thing, I would expect to have exactly that reaction but for some reason I don't.
Their live show is fucking awesome by the way - and I think semi-improvised?
― Matt DC, Thursday, 4 August 2011 11:31 (twelve years ago) link
yeah, it seemed like mostly songs in the first half, mostly jamming in the second half?
― generous loller at dollies (sic), Thursday, 4 August 2011 13:43 (twelve years ago) link
this is a very modern sounding house/pop album. it is extremely referential, as so much of dance music has been for quite a while now, but it combines so many different influences and yet still has a clear individual style. when they first dropped "hungry for the power" and "reckless" i was worried they would be kind of sampling different house sounds from the late 80s/early 90s as they continued (even tho those are still my classic faves), but with the release of "indigo" they started to identify their sound. they have some really interesting moments on this album. "change of heart" is one for me. pretty stoked on the album as a whole, even though a couple of the more aggressive songs i could take or leave.
― ashra williams (san frandisco), Monday, 8 August 2011 18:57 (twelve years ago) link
basically agreed.
― I'm a nerd and nerdy things happened (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 August 2011 18:49 (twelve years ago) link