ODD FUTURE WOLF GANG KILL THEM ALL

I do wonder what Syd tha Kid makes of all this.

I guess I kinda am. I can tell them from experience that I am a happier person for ignoring works of art that are specifically attempting to get a rise out of people like me.

they're not "people like you" - you're a straight white privileged lefty - they're women & queer - it's easy for you to ignore homophobia and misogyny - neither one impacts you directly as a person - that's what privilege is all about

I can tell them from experience that I am a happier person for ignoring works of art that are specifically attempting to get a rise out of people like me.

this is called "privilege"

xp!

uh I was referring to those works of art that ARE designed specifically to get a rise out of people like me (which is a different set of works than those that are designed to get a rise out of people like Tegan & Sara). I guess that wasn't clear...?

xp

unless you are seriously arguing that there are not works of art out there that are specifically intended to get a rise out of me, because um... there are.

are they secret?

i don't have access to jaymc's xls so color me curious

do I need to make a list? now who's oppressing who here lol

hint: I ALREADY CITED ONE on this very thread

it's like if I'm the guy getting worked up about Odd Future - you can say to me, "oh look, what the fuck do you care, how are they offending you personally" and you've got a valid point - but when you start talking down to people who're squarely under attack if misogyny and homophobia are in play, who're only saying "consider what you're praising when you praise this: something that attacks me personally" - then you're using your privilege to dismiss the concerns of marginalized ppl - and that is straight fucking bullshit imo

shakey mo, it might be worth pointing out that tegan & sara live in a country that does not even view them as full human beings with the same civil rights as straight people

TRUST ME guys...when I say these lesbians would be happier just shutting up and letting their peers mindlessly get off and chronicle the actions of guys who unrepentantly treat them like shit, I know of WHICH I SPEAK. TRUST.

shakey, works of art designed to get a rise out of straight white men tend not to do so by specifically using the language of an entrenched culture of violence against them

I am pretty sure Shakey is talking about being Jewish (no jaymc)

dude googleproof that shit

hey you know who else forced jews to identify themselves publicly HITLER

hope you are happy now guys

big difference is that, as a straight white middle class american male, there are TONS of things that can and even intend to offend me, get a rise out of me or w/e - but i'm basically immune to systematic oppression. therefore, it's easy to discount my own sense of outrage - those that offend me lack a weapon with which they might really hurt me, their bark lacks bite.

for those in less privileged and empowered positions, the luxury of indifference isn't so easily available.

surely someone on the Internet has made an oppression pyramid already so that we don't have to

tegan & sara live in a country that does not even view them as full human beings with the same civil rights as straight people

Canada?

harper has really changed shit up there

letting their peers mindlessly get off

is this really what's going on? are we talking about critics/musicians here? cuz that's a specific subset of the larger set of OF's audience. and they don't seem to be approaching this very mindlessly from what I can tell

and chronicle the actions of guys who unrepentantly treat them like shit

are you saying Tyler treats Syd like shit? really now

surely someone on the Internet has made an oppression pyramid already so that we don't have to

^^^

man i don't know what OF defenders would do if Syd The Kid wasn't there

If OF didn't find a lesbian to approve of their message, rock critics would have had to invent her

+: I found two very amusing pics by GISing "oppression pyramid" which will follow in separate posts
-: however the first hit was an Abu Ghraib pic I had hoped to not see again

http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/oo36/getsmartwakeup/Pyramidonfrontofbuilding.jpg

http://www.paulmcguire.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/article_luciferian_pyramid.jpg

something that attacks me personally

in general I would say it is always a mug's game to approach art as if it is directed at you personally.

xp

would listen to that album

xp

are you saying Tyler treats Syd like shit? really now

are you actually for-real gonna come w/"some of his best friends are lesbian"

just out of curiosity, are there other women in the OF entourage/circle or is there just like her and then earl's mom

hey croup's the one that made it into a personal THIS IS WHAT THEY DO IN REAL LIFE thing. which is just ridiculous on I dunno how many levels.

xp

yes, that's exactly what I did

I hear Danzig unrepentantly kills children. and Hasil Adkins keeps a girl's head in his TV set!

when I said "unrepentantly treat them like shit" I was talking on the most literal, unilateral level possible, OF literally treating all women and homosexuals like dookie

glad shakey's here to point out the flaws in that assumption, to make me realize that they don't actually put every lesbian in sight in a toilet bowl

do tell

i just did, or was that an xpost

OF is clearly an act that revels in doing things for shock value. If you want to rob something of it's shock value, the key is, duh, not to allow yourself to be shocked by it. Ignore it.

privilege.txt

lol

Tyler's brand of misogyny and homophobia is just a joke to him (in my opinion), whereas Eminem (for example) seemed to have some serious issues with women and gays. Tyler is a glorified internet troll trying to get a rise out of people just for kicks, and trying to have a grown-up conversation about gender, sexuality, etc. concerning an artist who doesn't take things seriously is bound to come off as moralizing and humorless, even if the issues being raised are incredibly worthwhile. It's like getting upset that Gwar glorifies violence. Even if you're right, it makes you sound like you're not actually engaging with the art in question, its meaning, its style. Sara's blog post sounds like all she knows about Tyler is that there are offensive lyrics in there, much like when the Catholic League boycotts a movie they haven't even seen.

pls to explain a more effective way to rob something of its shock value

xp

Thanking all of u for the most entertaining reading I've done in days. Near as I can suss out, Shakey is personally offended by the presence of corporate advertising on fucking BART trains but not by whatever is going on here. Also, if lesbians can't change people's minds they should keep their fool mouths shut. Or something.

seems like kind of a funny thing to ask of their peers when their peers appear to already be doing an awful lot of talking/thinking/writing about these guys tbh. but what do I know - sum total of blog posts/reviews I have read about this band = 2. maybe most of the articles about them do not address the homophobiz/violence/mysogyny. I kind of doubt it tho, it seems awful central to their music.

OTM. I must be reading all the wrong reviews and discussions because all but one (a dumb "fuck yeah" blog on the LA Times website) have spent a long time engaging with OF's bigoted language. People are already thinking about this - I assume T&S's aim is bigger than that.

polyphonic OTM

xpost maybe they meant "think harder"

― underrated earl sweatshirt fans i have boned (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, May 19, 2011 6:34 PM (33 minutes ago) Bookmark

OTM. I must be reading all the wrong reviews and discussions because all but one (a dumb "fuck yeah" blog on the LA Times website) have spent a long time engaging with OF's bigoted language. People are already thinking about this - I assume T&S's aim is bigger than that.

i think this current wave of discussion is a reaction to the wave of largely-unquestioning hype that got them here in the first place - obv i don't read p4k but i read somewhere say that they've been huge supporters for months and in that time hadn't really tackled the rapeyness/homophobia - and not just critics, there's the unquestioning support of the music industry, too - like eg richard russell, the straight white man with the critically beloved and supposedly super-ethical record label who signed tyler and basically made his current profile what it is - it's those people that i feel sara is aiming at, as well as the supposedly liberal indie kids who constitute a large portion of the OF audience

xpost Does "thinking harder" mean "thinking until you agree 100% with Tegan and Sara"?

actual sentence in pitchfork's "best o' OF" piece: Here's Bastard's basic appeal in one punchline: "Cruisin' in my go-kart at Walmart selling cupcakes/ Go 'head, admit it, faggot; this shit is tighter than butt-rape."

another (for context): More importantly, though, Bastard is just a straight-up great rap album, the first from the Odd Future camp.