― Mordechai Shinefield (Mordy), Saturday, 19 August 2006 23:53 (seventeen years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 20 August 2006 00:56 (seventeen years ago) link
Yeah, the maid keeps calling in sick.
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 20 August 2006 00:59 (seventeen years ago) link
Writer credits on "Jealousy": Kara DioGuardi, Paris Hilton, Scott Storch. I'd credit DioGuardi with lots of the beauty.
And I guess it's time to say that I've had an advance of the Platinum Weird CD for almost three weeks, it has powerful moments and tuneful moments, but overall it's not taking me to the moon. "Middling MOR pop-rock" underrates it, but still, that's its neighborhood (as opposed to Ashlee's restless, pained, complex, ecstatic, glorious MOR pop-rock).
[For those new to the thread, Platinum Weird is Kara DioGuardi and Dave Stewart, Kara singing lead, prod. by John Shanks, who co-writes four of the songs. Shanks and DioGuardi, together and separately, have had a hand in a huge chunk of the stuff being drooled over in this thread. You can be sure I'll have more to say on the alb.]
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 20 August 2006 01:41 (seventeen years ago) link
PARIS by PARIS HILTON, track by track: album of the year!In a shock move, people at the Other Place are being mean about this album. But it should be right up the Poptimist alley!
'Turn It Up' - a typical Scott Storch crunk'n'b banger which starts off with Paris yelping "yah! that's hott!" over minimal bleeps and beats, before it turns into this incredible super-polished Britney-fronting-Pussycat Dolls thing, breathy yelps and whispers for the verses and elegant lift-off synths for the chorus'Fightin' Over Me' - even more minimal, plinky-plonky synths and not much else as Paris sets Fat Joe and Jadakiss at each other's throats for the honour of, it turns out, being rejected by her. "All those boys, all those silly boys," she rolls her eyes, before inexplicably giggling "Welcome to Paris!" - pronounced the French way'Stars Are Blind' - you know this already. Gorgeous, yearning, boundlessly hopeful'I Want You' - even more plastic fantastic, underpinned by a massive horn sample which careers along like an unstoppable force over some sterling chord changes'Jealousy' - the one about Nicole Richie which I talked about yesterday'Heartbeat' - absolutely gorgeous ballad which drifts along on a cloud of dreamy, very 80s synths before bursting into a chorus which is, again, really, genuinely moving in its hopefulness and yearning. It reminds me of a cross between Annie's 'Heartbeat' and 'Time After Time', it's that good'Nothing In This World' - comes on like 'Since U Been Gone', having got the angst out of its system and able to breathe for the first time, donning its zip-up boots and heading down to the local disco for some whirlwind romance. If this means stealing another girl's man then so be it - Paris makes the line "I can do what she can do so much better!" sound like the most innocently optimistic thing ever. She doesn't mean to be mean! (Also, this album is the first I've heard which ties both strands of current teenpop - guitar-based confessional Lohan/Lavigne/Clarkson/Simpson Jr teenrock, and hott beatz'n'braggadocio r&b - together again - a really important accomplishment)'Screwed' - an absolute stormer, much better than the remix which got leaked last year. The tune is just unstoppable, the 4/4 kick under the chorus awe-inspiring, and the lyrics excellent - in the first verse it's all about "the same old story: boy meets girl and she falls much harder than him", in the second "boy falls under the spell of a woman from hell". Somewhere in there she would like intimacy over getting screwed but until then she'll merrily dance the night away. I have lobbied for this to be the next single!'Not Leaving Without You' - more amazing pop goodness; starts with thrumming disco synth and twanging country guitar before it explodes into an irresistible prime-80s-Madonna chorus of "We can dance! We can dance! We can dance!", a TICK-TOCK TICk-TOCK moment (surely now mandatory for all female popstrels) and a stomping, whirling conclusion PLUS RAP - "I wanna know what you dream about! I wanna know what you're thinkin' now! And when the lights go down and you come around, let me see what it's all about!" 'Turn You On' - back to the Storch crunk'n'b for a tongue-firmly-entrenched-in-the-bubblegum-lodged-in-Paris's-cheek tease of a song. "I'm sexy and you know it - clap your hands!" she orders before declaring "tonight I'll be your liquid dream" (nice, Paris, nice) and "Girls and boys are looking at me! I can't blame, I'm so sexy!" This is what I envisaged Paris's pop career to be like and she has not let me down'Do Ya Think I'm Sexy?' - initially I just thought this was funny, shoved on to the end of the album at Paris's insistence even though everyone else involved is slightly embarrassed, and backing away from her like everyone tries to pretend the drunk girl doing horrid karaoke isn't in their group of friends, oh no, we don't know her at all. But I think I like it properly now! I never thought I'd hear a version of this hitherto appalling song which made it not only tolerable but good
So, overall: POP ALBUM OF THE YEAR! Hurrah!
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 20 August 2006 05:11 (seventeen years ago) link
1 "Turn It Up" Bowden, Hilton, Magnet, Storch 3:122 "Fightin' Over Me" Fat Joe, Hilton, Jackson, Jackson, Jadakiss, Magnet, Storch 4:013 "Stars Are Blind" Garlbay, McCarthy, Solomon 3:564 "I Want You" Bogart, DioGuardi, Gibb, Rotem 3:125 "Jealousy" DioGuardi, Hilton, Storch 3:406 "Heartbeat" Alexander, Steinberg, Storch 3:437 "Nothing in This World" Gottwald, Solomon 3:108 "Screwed" DioGuardi, Wells 3:419 "Not Leaving Without You" DioGuardi, Hilton, Wells 3:3510 "Turn You On" Hilton, Jackson, Jackson, Storch, Triggs 3:0611 "Do Ya Think I'm Sexy" Appice, Hitchings, Stewart 4:34
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 20 August 2006 05:15 (seventeen years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 20 August 2006 05:26 (seventeen years ago) link
Um, P!nk certainly had these moments. And Clarkson too, though I wouldn't call it braggadocio, and it would be hott beat dance-pop more than hott beat r&b. Kelly was dance-pop before she was rock. But maybe in her case she alternates different types of songs rather than running them together.
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 20 August 2006 05:33 (seventeen years ago) link
― musically (musically), Sunday, 20 August 2006 05:52 (seventeen years ago) link
dancepop and confessional rock sit together more easily than r&b and confessional rock - even ashlee does it! while i can imagine any given teenrock singer doing an upbeat dancepop song, it's harder to imagine a clarkson or a simpson jr over storch productions like 'turn it up' or 'buttonz'.
― The Lex (The Lex), Monday, 21 August 2006 12:59 (seventeen years ago) link
Anyway, the bigger news is that Skye's track with Dr. Luke and Max Martin is confirmed, called "Girl Like Me." The only description of it so far is "rock" (duh) so probably Kelly C/Veronicas variety. Album pushed to next year, hopefully the single will come out before then.
Also, there's a little bit of the R&B past running through Pink's new stuff, U + UR Hand is like some weird union of GTPS and 4ever
― nameom (nameom), Monday, 21 August 2006 13:57 (seventeen years ago) link
(From Brooklynvegan)
Since when did Bob Dylan become such a blowhard? I'm reminded of when Woody Allen said that movies like American Pie are rubbish. Frank, don't you see Dylan as a part of the teen-pop tradition? I suppose Ashley Simpson will be dismissing pop music 30 years hence.
― Mordechai Shinefield (Mordy), Tuesday, 22 August 2006 17:54 (seventeen years ago) link
― Sterling Clover (s_clover), Tuesday, 22 August 2006 18:42 (seventeen years ago) link
"U + Ur Hand" seems like it's going to be a great song, "4ever" given chopped-up beats, but then goes awry with forced singing. Irritating.
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 23 August 2006 19:03 (seventeen years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 23 August 2006 19:14 (seventeen years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 23 August 2006 19:21 (seventeen years ago) link
Nah, that was Ashley Olson. Not sure whether or not that's weirder.
― nameom (nameom), Wednesday, 23 August 2006 19:26 (seventeen years ago) link
― nameom (nameom), Wednesday, 23 August 2006 19:27 (seventeen years ago) link
― nameom (nameom), Wednesday, 23 August 2006 19:43 (seventeen years ago) link
I'd like to see this in context before judging it. I mean, maybe he's just explaining how out of it he is. Or maybe he's explaining that nobody he knows, i.e. is personally acquainted with, has made a record that sounds decent (as opposed to all those decent-sounding records by people he's never met). </grasping at straws>
But it does seem stupid, doesn't it?
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 23 August 2006 21:27 (seventeen years ago) link
I like the song - esp. in the verse where it does a three note figure, then a variation on it but lower in the key, then another variation, still lower, very pretty. But the track has the same Brit sleekness that's often a barrier to my loving likable stuff by Girls Aloud, Rachel Stevens, Kylie, Sugababes, et al. This could reach me more after several plays, perhaps.
(No relation, btw.)
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Wednesday, 23 August 2006 22:01 (seventeen years ago) link
Curiously, given the way the discussion on this thread has gone, my feelings towards the Paris album aren't directed towards the singer as a persona/personality, just as my feelings towards t.A.T.u. aren't directed towards those two Russian girls and my feelings towards Boney M aren't directed towards Liz Mitchell. And I love t.A.T.u. and Boney M. Oddly enough, though I am moved incredibly by Diana Ross songs such as "Love Hangover" and "Ain't No Mountain High Enough" and "Swept Away," once again I'm not focusing those feelings on a personality or persona. This doesn't mean that I think Ross et al. have no input into their music, or that I don't hear a human voice in their singing, or for that matter that I don't have feelings and opinions about Ross et al. from what I know of their personalities/personas. Just that the feelings engendered by the music don't take the form of feelings towards a personality. (And of course this is very much the opposite of what goes on with me in regard to Ashlee, Kelly, and Lindsay. And damned if I know where I am with Hilary. She's a cipher, but that doesn't mean that my feelings aren't in search of some sort of personality there.)I can't say that I've a good idea why in some instances I hear a personality to take in my feelings and in others I don't.
-- Frank Kogan (edcasua...), August 25th, 2006. (Frank Kogan)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(Does anyone have a song-by-song producers list for the album? Allmusic.com specifies songwriters but not producers.)
Stephen Thomas Erlewine:
They come up with a sound that's casually modern and retro with enough heft in its rhythms to sound good at clubs, yet it's designed to be heard outdoors on the sunniest day of the summer. This is exceedingly light music, as sweet and bubbly as a wine spritzer, yet it isn't so frothy that it floats away.
Erlewine is a frog on a bump on a log, and I often think he's wrong, but he's a good critic, because he's willing to be surprised by albums and because he tries to be as articulate as possible about why he likes or dislikes something. In any event, I don't hear Paris the way Erlewine does. It's "light" in the sense of being unassuming and not coming across as trying to communicate anything weighty. But the actual sound is rather thick, layers of overdubbed vocals finding their way to choruses that often enough contain guitar chord upon guitar chord, the dense beauty of the vocals buried headfirst in the guitar thicket. The consistency I spoke of isn't just quality but timbre, different producers using the same strategies (maybe following Hilton's instruction). I don't know another album that has quite this sound. Paris's voice is itself unifying, something of a fuzzy uninflected hum from back in the throat. Compare Paris's Gottwald-written "Nothing In This World" to the Veronicas' Gottwald-written "Everything I'm Not." On "Everything" the singers are up there in the bright high pitch, working you over with ingratiating come-hither/fuck-off vocals. Whereas in "Nothing"'s pretty harmony section, Paris stays down in her comfy burr, relaxing. Not as arresting as the Veronicas, but not as irritating, either.
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 25 August 2006 18:17 (seventeen years ago) link
MARY WEISS, lead singer of the Shangri-Las, is recording her first album of new material since 1965 with the Reigning Sound for release on Norton Records, with Billy Miller and Greg Cartwright producing. Mary is selecting from a batch of great new comps from today's most talked-about songwriters including Greg Cartwright, John Felice, Andy Shernoff, Jackie DeShannon and others TBA!
Mary was fifteen years old when she and her sister Elizabeth (Betty) began singing with identical twins Margie and Mary Ann Ganser in their Cambria Heights neighborhood of Queens, New York, as students at Andrew Jackson High School. They soon came to the attention of George "Shadow" Morton and shot into the charts with massive hits on the Red Bird label including Remember (Walking In The Sand), Leader Of The Pack, Give Him A Great Big Kiss, I Can Never Go Home Anymore, Give Us Your Blessings and Out In The Streets.
The Shangri-Las gave a voice to real teenagers, with Mary's explosive lead vocals delivering emotion-packed melodramas that made them one of the most consistently exciting groups of the day.
They were twinpop!
I will point out, though, that their songs were written by real nonteenagers (which doesn't mean they can't have given voice to real teenagers, of course).
There was an ilM thread about this album several months back. Interesting set of songwriters, though it pretty much guarantees a retro sound mixed w/ neogarage-rock. As does the choice of the Reigning Sound as accompaniment, I'd think. Not that she should be going for a contemporary teenpop sound instead, necessarily (she's approx. 56). I'm just afraid that the garagers will put a haze of subcult oldiness around her. If all goes well, maybe there'll be some of the musical tension and ambition of a group like the Gore Gore Girls. After all, the '60s garage sound was part of the overall changes that put groups like the Shangri-Las out of business, and the Gore Gores mix it up in a cantankerous way.
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 25 August 2006 20:11 (seventeen years ago) link
Her current look'd actually work for country, I'd think.
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 25 August 2006 20:24 (seventeen years ago) link
http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/2388/maryweissys8.jpg
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 25 August 2006 20:25 (seventeen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Friday, 25 August 2006 20:31 (seventeen years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Saturday, 26 August 2006 02:30 (seventeen years ago) link
I mean, an heiress known best for nightvision porn and reality TV; where's the idol in that?
Lohan has this dramatic backstory to prop up her misadventures and so gain identification, Ashlee has that sweet, underdog thing, The Veronicas twiness provides enough Lacanian reverb to last days, Lily Allen has pluck and cheek.
Paris is just...blank. And, well, skanky. And what archetype are people saying Yes to when buying her stuff?
― Grey, Ian (IanBrooklyn), Saturday, 26 August 2006 04:12 (seventeen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Saturday, 26 August 2006 04:26 (seventeen years ago) link
Thing is, with almost all the Teenpop stars, even more than other genres, the persona is a huge part of the sell, and I think part of what engages us, something which I think has to do, again, with us projecting onto the mirror of the persona some aspect of ourselves.
I'm sorry to sound like a half-assed demi-academic, but I think it works like that. And hence, for me anyway, the total disconnect with Paris--there's so little there there, and what is there is just kinda Eww.
― Grey, Ian (IanBrooklyn), Saturday, 26 August 2006 04:37 (seventeen years ago) link
― Grey, Ian (IanBrooklyn), Saturday, 26 August 2006 04:40 (seventeen years ago) link
― Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Saturday, 26 August 2006 04:44 (seventeen years ago) link
don't know anybody who's made a record that sounds decent in the past twenty years, really," the 65-year-old rocker said in an interview with Rolling Stone magazine.
But doesn't Bob give a shoutout to Alicia Keyes somewhere on his new album? (which I haven't heard; I think I read that somehwere though.)
― xhuxk (xheddy), Saturday, 26 August 2006 04:58 (seventeen years ago) link
― Grey, Ian (IanBrooklyn), Saturday, 26 August 2006 16:51 (seventeen years ago) link
Anyway (and hopefully I won't get a weirdassed error message like the last four times I tried to say this), are people kind of saying Paris is the new Samantha Fox, only maybe less voluptuous? Because Samantha definitely made some excellent music, back in her day.
― xhuxk (xheddy), Saturday, 26 August 2006 17:05 (seventeen years ago) link
Paris is a mirror, because you have "projected or recognized or gained validation of some aspect of yourself," it's just against a negative or distorted reflection. (Maybe it makes sense that listening to her vocals on the album is like walking through a hall of funhouse mirrors)
xposts
― nameom (nameom), Saturday, 26 August 2006 17:11 (seventeen years ago) link
― Eppy (Eppy), Saturday, 26 August 2006 18:30 (seventeen years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Saturday, 26 August 2006 21:24 (seventeen years ago) link
("Tap That" doesn't seem to be getting any Top 40 airplay yet.)
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Saturday, 26 August 2006 21:50 (seventeen years ago) link
― KWIKLYX (pete38), Saturday, 26 August 2006 21:53 (seventeen years ago) link
Level one: Lindsay, Kelly, Liliy, et al, in their way of sunging and in their still images get across a certain sense of drama--not sad-drama, just of some sense of human material.
Then there's the tabloid bio stuff, which is hard to escape on some level.
Then there's the appealing vacuum presented bu assorted Euro-pop people--an emptiness that's intended, iconic or in some other way, essential to the idea.
Then there's Paris. I can imagine a very smart person--and a very meta incarnation of Hilton--utilizing the strange nothing she projects as a very lovely, disturbing thing.
But as she's using the usual route--with the attendant pleasures of good craftmanship--that zero-ness...well, it certainly doesn't add anything. And again, any awareness of her exploits--probably too scolding a word--adds a quesiness (for me at least.)
Still, I've written a few parapgraphs about thiss brand of nothjing so there must be something there.
― Grey, Ian (IanBrooklyn), Saturday, 26 August 2006 22:17 (seventeen years ago) link
I may yet hear a strong "Paris" personality in her music; too soon to tell. And I certainly don't think there'd be anything wrong in my letting what I know of her life contribute to what I feel when I hear the music. My guess is that no one on this thread or the Paris thread really has followed Paris that closely (the Sextape Paris, the Tabloid Paris, the Reality Show Paris, or the real-life Paris).
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Saturday, 26 August 2006 22:24 (seventeen years ago) link
I hear a similiar thing when I listen to the album. Even when it seems like the music is subverting my assumptions about Hilton, I wonder who has written the script. That, in of itself, wouldn't determine whether I like the album. I dislike it - but because of the sounds coming from my speakers. Nonetheless, the persona is inseperable from the album - and I feel manipulated, which is disasterious if Hilton is trying to liberate herself from this carefully plotted career.
― Mordechai Shinefield (Mordy), Sunday, 27 August 2006 01:05 (seventeen years ago) link
― Eppy (Eppy), Sunday, 27 August 2006 02:25 (seventeen years ago) link
Along the same lines, is it unthinkable that Hilton wouldn't read Pynchon on her own, or even suggest it to the writers, regardless of whether or not someone else actually wrote that into the script?
Also, Eppy, why is Paris iconic, and why is her status uniquely American? (I'm part genuinely curious because I've only been obsessed with Paris for a half a week, and part skeptical -- to me she seems like a relatively savvy tabloid icon, which may be a little different but no less pervasive than tabloid icons in the UK.)
― nameom (nameom), Sunday, 27 August 2006 15:02 (seventeen years ago) link
― nameom (nameom), Sunday, 27 August 2006 15:23 (seventeen years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 27 August 2006 22:15 (seventeen years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 27 August 2006 22:27 (seventeen years ago) link
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 27 August 2006 22:30 (seventeen years ago) link
(I will never be chosen to interview Ashlee, I guess. I'd have asked about the nosejob too. You have to. She's the one who, in Marie Claire, was profiled as working with kids on a project to demonstrate "That beauty comes in all shapes and sizes" and discussing eating disorders. And there she was on the cover with her innocuous, anonymous new nose. The dissonance screams at you. And she's the one who in "Shadow" said that the precondition for her finally being able to love her sister and parents was her realizing that it was "safe outside to come alive in [her own] identity." Not that she might not have good reasons for the nosejob, but she ought to say what they are. She's made the issue relevant. Not to mention that it's relevant to a celebrity anyway. Also, she'd probably have smart and interesting ideas on the subject. In Marie Claire she'd talked of various beauty trade-offs: as a teen, Jessica would use pliers to get into her jeans, while Ashless always wore stretch pants. If Ashlee wants to play volleyball, she can just put on a bra and go, whereas Jessica needs a fortified bra.)
― Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Sunday, 27 August 2006 23:00 (seventeen years ago) link