It is the equivalent of every time someone on ilx says, "That's why I'm glad I still purchase physical media."
― You can't spell Fearless without Earle (President Keyes), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 15:46 (one year ago) link
so they're saying "don't forget twitter.com is not a big book"?
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 15:49 (one year ago) link
i think its saying people think the internet is some magical always on thing but really its subject to the physical world, which is maybe true but doesnt really warrant the sage insight tone, i mean who gives a shit if twitter goes down really, except for caek who has to do some prob annoying work on it
― lagβn, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 15:50 (one year ago) link
I dunno. Maybe they mean climate change could wipe out the vast store of valuable tweets just like the Library of Alexandria was destroyed.
― You can't spell Fearless without Earle (President Keyes), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 15:51 (one year ago) link
I think they mean that data doesn't float around in an actual magic cloud, it lives in servers that are subject to environmental impacts just like everything else.
― Muad'Doob (Moodles), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 15:52 (one year ago) link
the one area imho people should think more about this is photographs, if theyre purely digital theyll be gone sooner than later, print them out if you want future generations to be looking at their great great grandmother
― lagβn, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 15:53 (one year ago) link
it's nothing to do with climate change fwiw.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 15:54 (one year ago) link
the headline says it is, the story doesn't, and the story is right.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 15:55 (one year ago) link
the story says:
"Extreme heat in California has left Twitter without one of its key data centers"
So the extreme heat has nothing to do with climate change?
― You can't spell Fearless without Earle (President Keyes), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:02 (one year ago) link
the failure of an air conditioning system (that every data center needs, even if you put the data center at the north pole) is nothing to do with climate change.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:04 (one year ago) link
don't put data centers at the north pole btw
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:06 (one year ago) link
Are we reading a different story?
βOn September 5th, Twitter experienced the loss of its Sacramento (SMF) datacenter region due to extreme weather. The unprecedented event resulted in the total shutdown of physical equipment in SMF,β Carrie Fernandez, the companyβs vice president of engineering, said in an internal message to Twitter engineers on Friday.
― You can't spell Fearless without Earle (President Keyes), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:06 (one year ago) link
like I know you have inside knowledge, but the story does talk about weather and extreme heat
― You can't spell Fearless without Earle (President Keyes), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:07 (one year ago) link
Ultimately: were climate change conditions responsible for the cooling system failure or did it just fail regardless
― Evan, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:10 (one year ago) link
ah, yeah sorry, skipped the quote from comms. "due to extreme weather" is ... arguable. can't say more. anyway yes, it's an interesting story! it's not interesting because βthe internet is physical and also you canβt just accumulate infinite data and expect it to always be availableβ
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:10 (one year ago) link
β lagβn, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 bookmarkflaglink
I get the sense from tech people that data will always be safe and available until the end of time (or the end of twitter).
So here we have a story where climate change is saying nope.
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:17 (one year ago) link
i don't think anyone in tech thinks that.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:20 (one year ago) link
I do.
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:22 (one year ago) link
tech is full of the weirdest long termist / thought experiment / prepper people. these people are mostly insane, but you can't accuse them of blithely assuming that datacenters will never go down. they worry about a list of thing that includes asteroids.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:23 (one year ago) link
if they had a magical belief that all data was safe then twitter would be down right now, and when it came back up it would be missing data.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:24 (one year ago) link
That's what I'm saying, they have magical beliefs. There is definitely no logic to it.
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:29 (one year ago) link
this reminds me, do we have a thread about the long termist/effective altruism movement?
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:36 (one year ago) link
Recent discussion here - rationalism AI cultist creeps
― death generator (lukas), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:39 (one year ago) link
β π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, September 13, 2022 12:06 PM (thirty-three minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink
too late im doing it now
― lagβn, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:41 (one year ago) link
thank you xp
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 16:44 (one year ago) link
if you run a/c systems a lot more than usual they're likely to wear out, but sometimes they just... do that.. regardless. or break
one of those thing where I'd almost trust someone with an hvac background to manage a group of people administering a data center than I would some software developer who has worked their way up, because one group understands the rate of mechanical failure, and the other has a lot of weirdos who have brain holes
― mh, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:03 (one year ago) link
one interesting thing about this has been seeing the order in which they're letting people bring systems back up, which is very highly correlated with the amount of brain holes one associates with that subgroup of engineers. i.e. the less you know about software, the sooner you get back in.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:40 (one year ago) link
and if you know anything about machine learning you're at the back of the line, which is 100% fair enough.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:41 (one year ago) link
machines should not be allowed to learn
― lagβn, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:42 (one year ago) link
another reason βthe internet is physical and also you canβt just accumulate infinite data and expect it to always be availableβ is dumb is its use of the word "infinite" tbh
― mark s, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:47 (one year ago) link
I have visited a large data center and this is close to the truth. One of the guys managing the data center talked about a certain piece of software for distributing work across machines as being rated to XX megawatts, which kinda floored me.
― death generator (lukas), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:48 (one year ago) link
Maybe βthe Internet is not eternalβ is a shock to people too young to have lost their Geocities pages.
― papal hotwife (milo z), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:51 (one year ago) link
they are amazing places. wish i'd gone into hardware tbh. i'm not sure if it's a problem or not that building them in a way that is truly resilient is beyond the abilities of everyone (including nation states) except aws, gcp and azure.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:51 (one year ago) link
Print out your tweets, people!
― You can't spell Fearless without Earle (President Keyes), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:52 (one year ago) link
i actually do run https://github.com/dogsheep/twitter-to-sqlite as a daily cron job
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:54 (one year ago) link
Perhaps compile them into a book⦠about hipster puppies.
― papal hotwife (milo z), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:54 (one year ago) link
i needlepoint all my tweets
― lagβn, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:55 (one year ago) link
You know--if there was a printer that was continuously printing out all the tweets ever tweeted on a single piece of paper, that paper would be long enough to... (1/18)
― You can't spell Fearless without Earle (President Keyes), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:59 (one year ago) link
probably belongs on our tech jobs thread but since it's topical --
one of the data science/machine learning leads that left my employer earlier this year, along with everyone else who knew it was arriving, bought some machine learning in a crate hardware stack that's full of Nvidia A100s and it has two 3000W power supplies plus redundancies, so four power supplies total
it's been sitting in the crate outside of the data center in another state for a while. right now, they're trying to figure out how to plug it in to the grid in a way that can actually power the damn thing
― mh, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 17:59 (one year ago) link
ha yes, one downside of the crash in gpu prices is that it makes financial sense to own them rather than rent them again, but owning them is hard.
― π ππ’π¨ (caek), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:00 (one year ago) link
oh, I am guessing they ordered this thing before the prices dropped. it was like $250K
but if you look at, say, AWS gpu compute bills, you can still come out ahead
― mh, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:04 (one year ago) link
tbf "hey yall, the internet isn't immaterial, it depends on physical hardware" was a significant enough academic trend in the mid-2010s for a few scholars to make their reps on itβI'm not dissing those people, that work is all pretty goodβbut condescendingly chiding people about it in 2022 is silly. I met a cartoonist making a book about internet (and other) infrastructure a couple years back, but his book is for younger readers.
― rob, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:12 (one year ago) link
I just mumble the "yay, cloud!" catchphrase from the Microsoft commercials of yesteryear
― mh, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:21 (one year ago) link
whoever came up with the name the cloud was a genius, its confounded millions of people who had to watch a commercial during a football game
― lagβn, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:24 (one year ago) link
its sounds awesome but then youre like wait what the fuck
― lagβn, Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:25 (one year ago) link
'cloud' is still currency in provincial government but then everyone here is stupid so
― (grim) pump track (wales) (map), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:42 (one year ago) link
the cloud is really in our hearts
― You can't spell Fearless without Earle (President Keyes), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:44 (one year ago) link
not in mine
― (grim) pump track (wales) (map), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:45 (one year ago) link
no, you clicked the agreement
― You can't spell Fearless without Earle (President Keyes), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 18:46 (one year ago) link
did the ilxbook ever get published or not?
― i cannot help if you made yourself not funny (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 13 September 2022 20:23 (one year ago) link