Literary Clusterfucks 2013

And I should mention that I agree with plax— these people are all much too much invested in "mainstream" literary success, whatever that means, instead of focusing on their art, which should be the point of all of this anyway.

Well except that 'focusing on their art' does seem one of the most normative ideals that gets trotted out (by Larson)

Whatever, it's the truth, as normative as it might be. Most people who say it don't actually practice what they preach.

Exactly. These kinds of commonplaces have to be arbitrated in more or less fine-grained ways to delineate correct, respectable kinds of conduct.

Totally— here, Larson is using it as shorthand for "don't pay attention to the sources for my work, just focus on the messages that I would like to be inhered in the work."

My point is that many, many artists and writers, myself included on occasion, would do well to ignore gossip and drama and interpersonal BS and just focus on the work that they are making or trying to make.

maybe “the kindest” is more interesting than the gossip behind it.. but i seriously doubt it

Yes exactly! it's the same kind of Protestant acetic ideal of the artist (solitary, unmotivated by material reward or recognition) that informs their discomfort with her kidney story

is dreamer/exceller some malcolm gladwell pop psych shit?

some would say that, but they are wrong

oh dear

It's from a debate about a Simpsons joke. I only brought it up because table's statement that it boggled his mind that someone could see things differently is a sentiment that came up about 1000 times on that thread

Oh boy, the New York Times Magazine! That's where I'm a Bad Art Friend!

Hate to cross the streams but one last time until the next last time

Ppl are alarmed and appalled that the excellers think they might be right

Not that they think can see something different if they squint

how many dreamers does it take to screw in a lightbulb?

only one, because that's where they're a viking, and that means they're excellent at changing lightbulbs

everyone invoking that stuuuuuupid viking thread should be fp’d

why did I imagine VG yelling that at the thread out of a car window

Jesus lets not

oh great now I'm going to have to read a thread about vikings, too?

only if you will follow it up by dousing your eyes with acid, which is the only known antidote to that thread

xp Yeah otherwise a lot of the references here will read like norse code

imma douse my eyes with acid after that quip, dmac

humour

Thats where im an eyesting

Oh boy, a stranger's body, that's where I'm a kidney!

u_u

quincie that thread is about vikings the way larson thinks moby dick is about whales

that thread will form the capstone of my ilx novel cycle, deems is the villain as usual

Cast aspersions

Dorland started this whole thing by acting unhinged af, inviting the mockery and scrutiny of those whom she erroneously considered colleagues. The resulting situation sucks for her, and exposes the meanness and pettiness of those supposed colleagues but it also is of her own making.

― I'm a sovereign jazz citizen (the table is the table), Thursday, October 7, 2021 1:17 PM (seven hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

good take on bullying

dorland is certainly narcissitic in a way that feels needy and lacks self awareness. she is cringe. but larson and her friends seem mean. i have no view on the lawsuit—seems frivolous, but still

I hate to have to spell this out but at root the issue is about being cool, and dorland is not cool. larson is bad too but this all started with dorland being weird and not cool

donated a kidney
and seeks acclaim
you give writers
a bad name

sorry

truly i am

real-life lol at that

brilliant. truly.

Lol, also where is this viking thread, cannot find

just don't do it. srsly

kudos VG

I hate to have to spell this out but at root the issue is about being cool, and dorland is not cool. larson is bad too but this all started with dorland being weird and not cool

lol this was my relatable take too. It's the awkward dork wanting to sit at the cool kids table.

i tried to explain this story to my girl and all she wanted to know is why i would care about any of this nonsense and i was deeply ashamed to reply "uh... the discourse, i guess?"

Simply too cringe, just not cool enough, for the elite coterie, that august literary salon, *checks notes* the chunky monkeys

the chunky monkeys of grub street

I hate to have to spell this out but at root the issue is about being cool, and dorland is not cool. larson is bad too but this all started with dorland being weird and not cool

lol this was my relatable take too. It's the awkward dork wanting to sit at the cool kids table.

I mean, the modern version of "the cool kids table" is effectively "a group of people who are shitty and awful to other people, who people 'like' out of fear of themselves becoming a target". I know a Dorland very well and he's totally harmless, I wouldn't ever call him out on his "narcissistic altruism" because at the end of the day his good work is still good work. I know a couple of Larsons too and they're the shittest people I've ever met

otm

Isn't that pretty much the traditional version of the cool kids table too?

ilx has a dorland-to-larson ratio of about 1:1 which is what keeps it exciting

which are you crut

i think i’m a dorland (inwardly needy just not outwardly so lol)

you're being too self-deprecating there, VG

well i know i’m not a mean girl like larson

i'm not sure that many of us are actually dorlands or larsons tbh though i guess there must be some

archetypes is all we’re talking here