"I Hope You're Happy Now, Jacob"--The LOST Season 5 Thread

I think it's just hints and easter eggs for the dedicated. also shout-outs to the writers' sci-fi inspirations.

Valis, Wizard of Oz, The Little Prince, Borges, there's been tons

I think the Purple Sky event changed a lot of stuff - it seemed that suddenly the island was exposed to the outside world and more discoverable

Yeah, I think this is true.

So let's suppose the island was always moving up until Desmond turned the failsafe key. Then it stopped moving and was discoverable by Widmore and Penny. (But the 815 survivors weren't rescued because no one was looking for them anymore.) So Jacob told Locke to turn the wheel to get it moving again, which had the incidental effect of making the islanders jump through time.

sounds pretty good - the time traveling i imagine under that scenario wouldnt be incidental tho

they were jumping through time because the wheel was off its axis. then when locke fixed it they stopped wherever they were at that moment (1970s apparently)

My guess is that the Island itself is actually constantly moving through time, and not actually in space at all, and it only appears in whatever place it's supposed to be at certain moments. Ben turning the wheel dislodged that, which may have caused Juliet, Sawyer, Locke etc to become unstuck from the Island's own time-jumping.

God, the Daniel episode is going to be the headfuck to end all headfucks, isn't it?

I also wonder whether it was Desmond pressing buttons that was moving the Island, or keeping it on the right course, or whatever...

daniel should just give a short hurley to his mom style summery and leave it at that

Just watched this. I really liked the episode for it's pace, but too much loose ends and well, stupidity, left me feeling unsatisfied. I mean, Jack not immediately reading the suicide letter, wtf? Ben's lines were classic, but too much 'not-asking' has been left uncalled for.

And fuck, before I caught on this thread today I genuinely thought Sayid was being held custody by Ana Lucia! Guess not. And help me out here: why is it assumable that Penny is dead? I don't really get that one.

Man, I dread the people who watch this show without internets theory and moral support. I'm surprised sometimes people outside this thread watch this show at all!

And help me out here: why is it assumable that Penny is dead?

I'm kind of rethinking that one myself. Killing her is pretty clearly why Ben was at the marina, but Des + Widmore's hired help might have been enough protection. But it wouldn't surprise me a bit if she's dead.

I just don't think her death would go so unnoticed. We can't tell from the wounds on Ben's face that Penny got offed. It could easily be Ben getting kicked the shit out by Widmore's goons, as pointed out above. Widmore may not really show much affection, but Penny's still his daughter. Or am I going about this too much like a soap opera?

Best line of the episode wasn't Ben's "who cares?", it was Franks "we're not going to Guam are we?".

I'm surprised sometimes people outside this thread watch this show at all!

Ha, there are other threads in other corners of the Internet. I've been really liking this guy lately.

Lady with the badge escorting Sayid probably working for Ben.

I kind've assumed Hurley and Kate showed up because he got a visit from Charlie and she got a visit from Claire, or something. (My wife said "Maybe Claire showed up and took her son back.")

the donkey wheel moves the island in time

OK, but

1. When Ben turned the FDW, the island also physically disappeared from the ocean (we saw the ripple).
2. I thought it was just the Losties that were going back in time, not the island itself.

Of course, if it is the island going back in time, and it is always moving, then it physically moved because it went back to a time when it was somewhere else.

OK, this is really http://treebeard31.files.wordpress.com/2008/09/calvin.gif

When Ben would say "all six of you have to go back," was he including John but not Aaron?

Yeah I also figured Charlie figured into Hurley's decision to go because he brought the guitar.

xp

ugh faradays mom is corny corny corny

Best line of the episode wasn't Ben's "who cares?", it was Franks "we're not going to Guam are we?".

OTM, I kept thinking "the flight attendant is standing right there! she's going to know something is up!" But no.

I actually thought the last episode was dumber than this one, but whatevs.

nah last episode was great! kate/aaron episode was about as bad as this one tho.

i'm still wondering what difference it would've made if the O6 hadn't left at all, like why was it so important for them to have remained on the island? would they not have been time-skipping? would charlotte have lived? it doesn't seem as if them being around would've changed anything much - they'd all still be time-skipping and someone would still have had to readjust the donkey wheel.

I guess we have to assume that the Others always had a way to find it when they made off-island excursions. But did they have to recreate the conditions of their arrival, too?

no but seems like this is a special case - the island needed the proxies to recognize those who should never have left and drop them in the correct time. if the O6 hadn't left, they would be time-skipping with the rest and landed in the 1970s, so that's when they are now.

i think ajira airways crashed in 2007/2008 and three kings dude + sayid's escort + whoever else were prob the people in that boat shooting at the time-jumpers. Those people didn't crash in the 70s because they weren't meant to be there.

Either that or 70s Dharma island temporarily appeared in a certain place in 2007/08.

I hope all the dudes who stayed behind are working for the Dharma initiative. Especially Sawyer - I predict COMEDY.

Also, really happy that Aaron isn't around.

Not sure what the real reason will be for her going back to the island, but I predict that Claire's mother will be back for that flashback, and that Kate gives Aaron up to her.

Pretty sure Kate gave up Aaron to Claire's mother and is now pregnant with Jack's baby.

^^^I know this sounds like total soap opera garbage.

I'm thinking Kate turned up at Jack's in order to get herself knocked up.

70s Dharma Sawyer would be awes. he's got the hair already.

Basically I'm really looking forward to the inevitable bit where Jin, Hurley and Sawyer meet Horace and are all like "uh, sorry we snapped your head off dude".

It's funny how a lot of reviews I've read seem to say "this is the line!" where suspension of disbelief is just going too far - interesting. A magical island that travels through space and time and keeps people immortal and chooses good and bad people and has a smoke monster was really crazy, but this recreating flight 815 thing is just over the line! I'm not saying it isn't totally ridiculous, of course, just kind of odd that this was the crossing point...

If they do the "Kate gets pregnant with Jack's babeh to be Claire on the plane", which does seem like it's gonna happen, now THAT's gonna take some weird twisted logic...

I think it's the difference between science fiction and fairy tale stuff. I was glad to see all the faithy bullshit go whenever it was that they originally de-emphasized it (after S3?), and it kind of sucks that it's back again.

It's funny how a lot of reviews I've read seem to say "this is the line!" where suspension of disbelief is just going too far - interesting.

As much as I still enjoy the show, I too feel they're pushing it. Or it's pushing me to the line where the mystery becomes the absurd. The first two, three seasons for me were special because it was so intruiging. The writing was also slower, and ofcourse we want to know everything, but the way how Lady Faraday just blurted out a near complete history of the island yesterday was a bit too much for me. The narrative gets so sped up now it's almost spinning out of control.

i think the recreating flight 815 thing is fine, it's the near complete lack of curiosity from the main characters that's gotten bothersome. anyway, sepinwall's recap nails exactly what was wrong with this episode: it centred around jack, the one guy who has no reservations left about returning to the island, so there was no drama or obstacle to get past. it would've been much more interesting to see what convinced kate or hurley (and i'm sure we'll get those stories soon anyway) but it just made *this* particular episode boring and absurd.

I think they just wanted to get the O6 back to the island as quickly as possible, somewhat wisely really.

yeah true i was very glad that they didn't wait until mid-season to get everyone back.

Do we know what the significance is of Hurley bringing (Charlie's?) guitar? Can this be looked at the same way as Jack 'brought' his father's shoes? Bring something from the dead?

Maybe Aaron's hidden in the guitar case.

I felt really let down by that episode. The Mrs Hawking stuff was just terrible:
"THIS IS HOW THEY FOUND THE ISLAND"
"O K COOL HOW ARE WE GET BACK?"

Sorry? I think you meant to ask:

WHAT IS THE DHARMA INITIATIVE?
HOW CAN A F***ING ISLAND MOVE THROUGH SPACE AND TIME?
WHY DO WE NEED TO GO BACK?

I understand that it's Lost and people don't ask questions but this series it really is descending into self-parody. Is THAT really the best explanation we are going to get about how to get to/from the island? I really hope not.

All that said, I'm really pleased they have got them back on the island by episode 5 when most of us were convinced it would take the whole series. That it took such a sloppy episode to achieve this = meh

OK Can we try to sort this one out (it hurts my head):

Desmond goes to buy Penny a ring from Mrs Hawking but changes his mind, then ends up going on a boat race and eventually on the island.

After the hatch explodes Desmond ('s consciousness?) travels back in time and he goes to try to buy Penny a ring again but this time tries to go through with it. Mrs Hawking convinces him not to, and that his destiny is to go to the island.

But initially, the first time around (if this even means anything?), Desmond went to the island without any persuasion from Mrs Hawking. Why then does he blame her for the 4 years of his life he spent on the island?

I think the second time round became the 'official' event, ie Desmond rewrote his past with Mrs Hawking in it?

The more you think about Desmond the more confusing it becomes.

isn't Ben killing Penny going the only reason Des would be motivated to return to the island (i.e. revenge), assuming that he will at some stage?

So when you travel back in time - you can change small stuff, you can have different conversations, but you can't change 'big' things like going on a boat race? Makes no sense - where does the separation of scales occur? This event has 20% more universal importance that that event, universe says no sorry.

it's more that the ISLAND says no (and not sorry)

Desmond is special somehow, I think is the thing.

I am half thinking 'actually just never explain why/how Hurley and Sayid got on the plane' because it might be more fun than whatever dumb explanation they'll eventually provide.

Lady with the badge escorting Sayid probably working for Ben.

I think she may be a real Marshall, but it was def. Ben who tipped someone off about the golf course murder.

When Ben would say "all six of you have to go back," was he including John but not Aaron?

Maybe he meant Frank. He was supposed to be piloting O-815, and keeps being drawn to the island. Maybe that's why Smokey attacked the fat guy from Heroes--he got pissed that Lapidus wasn't the pilot.

hmm i like that

I kind of like that they followed Jack's POV. They had so much stuff to get through in this episode, it would have been too much if they had dealt with or followed any of the characters whose reasons for going back needed explaining.

Sorry? I think you meant to ask:

WHAT IS THE DHARMA INITIATIVE?
HOW CAN A F***ING ISLAND MOVE THROUGH SPACE AND TIME?
WHY DO WE NEED TO GO BACK?

From the viewpoint of the people standing in the room in that scene, how are any of those questions important? Maybe, conceivably, to Jack, on an intellectual level. But Ben knows the answer to #1, and thinks he knows #3, and doesn't really care about #2. For Sun, none of those questions is key to the task, "Just get me back to my husband." Desmond doesn't care about any of them, because he isn't going anywhere anyway. So which of the characters was supposed to ask those questions?

And if anyone had asked those questions Hawking would have had to say "Hold your damn horses, we've still got another season and a half."

Though I would have liked it if Sun had asked about the four toed statue and Hawking told her she needed to bring along a giant shoe in her luggage.

and that they'd need some heroin, and Jack would need to persuade the stewardess to give him extra vodka

i think ajira airways crashed in 2007/2008 and three kings dude + sayid's escort + whoever else were prob the people in that boat shooting at the time-jumpers. Those people didn't crash in the 70s because they weren't meant to be there.

― Disco/Very (Roz), Friday, February 20, 2009 12:27 AM (8 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

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