Scottish Independence - classic or dud

http://ianssmart.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/three-tweets.html

Now, you can agree or disagree with that sentiment and, with the benefit of hindsight, I should have put the words "Poles and Pakis" in quotation marks for it is clearly a sentiment I was ascribing to others.

ah, apologies that apologize for nothing, my favourite kind

"As an imperialist, class-based state, the UK is poorly equipped to meet the divergent needs of its constituent nations in this rapidly transmuting world. Scotland and England both deserve better, as do Wales and Northern Ireland. Whether the change to facilitate this comes from the 2014 Scottish referendum or not might be important to Scots, but is almost irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. The point is that it will happen. The Union Jack is the increasingly shrinking fig leaf that strives to cover the growth of an English nationalism and consciousness, which is visible in almost every aspect of life in these islands over the last thirty years. And that, in a post-imperial world, is how it should be, and probably how it has to be. The problem that the Scots, Welsh and Northern Irish have to face, is that they have no place at this party, and neither should they: it just isn’t a great deal to do with them."

http://bellacaledonia.org.uk/2013/01/10/irvine-welsh-on-scottish-independence-and-british-unity/

the growth of an English nationalism and consciousness, which is visible in almost every aspect of life in these islands over the last thirty years

Uh, really?

you querying the 30 years bit?

anyway "that, in a post-imperial world, is how it should be, and probably how it has to be" = lay off the smack, son

lol he wrote a book about heroin addicts

More the "visible in almost every aspect of life in these islands", does he mean those plastic St George's flags?

you don't notice a hint of assertive little Englanderness anywhere in public life of late?

maybe just a suggestion that there are a few English people who regarded themselves as a separate and, dare i whisper it, a favoured nation?

"visible in almost every aspect of life in these islands" is a bit much

well so's the implication that nationalism is great even when it's as pigheaded and ugly as the English variety but i'd stopped taking him serious by then

I never took him seriously in the first place!

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/15/scottish-independence-amazing-referendum

People of the north, it's time to choose. English? Or Scottish?

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/dec/01/scotland-vote-yes-scottish-independence?CMP=twt_gu

The guy writes with that breezily chummy style that bugs me so much on comment is free... but he's actually really good at it, and it makes all the difference.

The idea seriously makes sense as well.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/shortcuts/poll/2014/feb/26/poll-british-flag-scotland-independent

Clearly 7 is the best.

5 would make a good techno album cover, but not national flag.

8, 9 and 10 are hilariously bad. 5 is awesome.

I like the scandinavian simplicity of 2

1 looks like a tea tray you might find at your gran's house.

Anyway my support for 7 comes from the fact that if we're going to live in an anachronistic monarchy we may as well have some hardcore medieval looking shit on our flag.

I'm embarrassed not to know this, but where does the yellow come from on those flags?

Don't say dog piss

The Carling vomit littering the streets of our fair coastal towns.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Saint_David (also explains the black.)

it would be pleasing if there actually was some black in the union jack

oh thanks merdeyeux! seems like 12 would be the most sensible option then, but with black instead of blue

On a similar note here are some early designs for the Union flag from I guess the 17th Century.

http://www.sovereignty.org.uk/features/articles/jacks.jpg

Anyway my support for 7 comes from the fact that if we're going to live in an anachronistic monarchy

Don't forget Scotland's going to be part of the same anachronistic monarchy after independence

And I fully expect their flag to be an image of the Queen enjoying a can of Irn Bru.

you can check out any time you want

That won't leave Rangers' fans with very much to sing about to keep their spirits up

12 but black instead of blue

Oh no, just what we dont need in the referendum debate
http://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/referendum-news/orange-order-may-stage-pro-union-march-on-eve-of-scottish-referendum.24188536

Apparently they also have a campaign called British Together

Darling losing his cool here

i would be watching but stv player is knackered. what am i missing?

Not much. Salmond's voice is a bit more nasal than I remember but I'm not holding it against him

would an independent scotland have shit streaming?

There are some dodgy looking individuals in the audience there

Salmond seems to be trying to stare Darling down

And he's doing his thing of walking out from behind the podium again

idk just kinda feel its unseemly all this demanding independence from the Brits without yknow actually yknow, v unceltly imo

Audience seems to be mostly pro-independence

It's balanced, it's just the No side aren't making themselves heard. Interesting, that

eck much better this time around i thought

Classic

EU >>>> UK

Except last time round the assumption was England would be in the EU. Now have to choose trading partner: England or eurozone?

So classic that I believe Scottish voters should have voted for it first time. Salmond is saying the second Scottish independence referendum should happen within the next two and a half years, which I think is very likely.
http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/1819E/production/_90081789_eu_ref_results_map_promo976.png
(map in the middle is the actual result - blue = leave, yellow = remain)

god, remember when nationalism was awful and only a Tory would want to secede from the UK? crazy times