The Haunt Of Fear: ILX Top 100 HORROR Movies Poll Results Thread

Yeah, a point in Martyrs favor is that it is not this surreal, stream of consciousness orgy of violence. It's pretty methodical. Almost ... surgical.

Man, I hate Cube. All of the Cubes.

Martyrs is insultingly awful. I threw a ton of points at my own pick for the best of the new-Euro horrors (Belgium's Calvaire) but I gather that has absolutely no shot.

calvaire was one of my very last cuts, and in retrospect i regret not throwing some points its way. i love it, but had too many sentimental favorites i just couldn't let go of. the one representative of "new french extremity" i did save room for was claire denis' trouble every day, which got one of my top 10 slots.

It's pretty methodical. Almost ... surgical.

lol

I mean I love Cube and it's incoherence too, but with Martyrs it was more of a plot device of sorts where with Cube it was just a shrug. They used their lack of explanation in very different ways and Martyrs was a lot smarter about it.

tl;dr option: M was my #1 and I don't give a fuck if it's not horror. Also, genre is more a perpetual activity than a thing per se, more a verb than a noun

I am the first-place voter for M and I have no interest in proving its status as a horror film. I only voted in this because jjj asked me to. And not only did he muck up his ballot with post-classical caca but now he's on vacation during the genre bloodbath?!?!? For shame! :) So I just voted for what I thought were the greatest films listed in the noms and figured the very fact that a film was nominated was genre justification enough for me. Took about 10 mins. if even that. In fact, I did it so quickly that I forgot another greatest film of all time contender Night of the Hunter and also Vampyr so I'm glad the latter has shown up. Sorry, Carl. With me, you would've placed way higher. So if you want to hear why M might be the greatest film of all time, I'll oblige. But if you want to know why it's a horror film, forget it. I don't even like the genre (although really it's the serial killer film that I hate).

I do think that the arguments about boundaries in this thread (and others like it, I presume) reveal a misunderstanding about genre because genre is more a perpetual activity than a thing per se, more a verb than a noun. As Rick Altman puts it, "genres must be seen as a site of struggle among users" (in Film/Genre, p. 99). Or here's a juicier quote: "Whereas no critical discourse, however prestigious and oft repeated, can become part of Hamlet, even the lowliest of genre critics cannot help but contribute to the genre itself" (84).

So when Edward says "there's a difference between a horror movie with a social conscience and a film of social conscience that is horrifying" and then Deric says "if the audience reacts to a film as if it were a horror film, it should qualify as a horror film at least as much as the rote garbage that's only accepted as horror," it's necessary to determine how they're using genre and the value of their approaches. Edward privileges production when he conceives of genre and Deric privileges reception. But to better grasp the discursive (language-like, argumentative) nature of genre, the goal is to incorporate as wide a variety of genre uses as possible.

So Edward's statement is "right" given how he uses genre. But Larry Cohen uses genre differently. Any interview with him makes clear that he conceives of It's Alive as a film of social conscience that is horrifying rather than a horror movie with a social conscience. I'm not privileging Cohen's voice over Edward's. Rather, the genre lies somewhere in between, within the conversation. Similarly, if someone pisses their pants to Threads, then it's a horror film to Deric. Sure, no prob. But if you watched me watching The Long, Long Trailer, I guarantee you would've thought I was watching a triple feature of Martyrs, Inside, and Henry rather than a supposedly light and breezy Desi and Lucy comedy. In short, the applicability of these approaches shift depending on user and context.

And the same applies to greatness and masterpieces and all that. Masterpieces are waaaay a discursive formation as Saint Foucault once told me in a bathhouse in New Orleans. Stevie D might think there's a way to distinguish between the most enjoyable films and the greatest (he really doesn't think this but let's humor him) but there's no hard and fast rule that could determine the distinction. In fact, the very idea that great and favorite can be distinguished is meant to hide the self-interest behind proclaiming greatness.

Man, I hate Cube. All of the Cubes.

yeah, not a cube fan. did like the part where that one guy got cut up into little person cubes. otherwise meh.

http://www.tcj.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/McCheese-Picasso.jpg

I tried to watch Cube II the other day and it was sooooooo terrible. The first is so poorly overacted that it's hard to enjoy, too, for that matter.

"genres must be seen as a site of struggle among users"

this is true of a great many things, for instance ILX threads

Idk, I enjoy a lot of banal and mediocre things that I'd have a hard time calling great

Thx KJB, that post pretty much justifies all the preceding hue n cry. (And hopefully obviates more.)

Man, I know it (obviously) has its defenders here, but I finally was able to sit through "Witchfinder General," and, huh, I don't get it. Just lots of people riding horses back and forth and occasionally burning someone at the stake. Did it have a plot? Because if so, I totally missed it.

(However, now I'm listening to Witchfinder General's "Friends of Hell," and it is awesome)

Also I will acknowledge that Satantango is a great film but there are abt 10,000 other films I will pick before I choose to rewatch it.

Sorry, Carl. With me, you would've placed way higher.

Took me about ten very puzzling seconds to figure out you weren't talking to me.

Thanks for that, KJB. A vast improvement of what I was trying to say earlier. Genre application seems so subjective to me that it's hardly worth arguing about too much. But that doesn't mean it isn't fun to do so.

And thanks for the Kupperman panel, contenderizer. I knew the "hating cubes" thing reminded me of something.

lol another snake n bacon fan!

xp

Re: torture porn, once we were getting free Showtime & I turned to it at a prime-town hour, like 8pm, and it was some mainstream torture porn movie and was featuring a recognizable actress lashed to a table and being forced to drink a smoothie of blended-up body parts by having a funnel shoved into her mouth. Can't remember the movie or the actress. But it really drove home again how screwed up violence/sex limits are in American media. I mean, imagine what the porn equivalent of that scene would be, presented at 8pm for all the kiddies.

― The Thnig, Friday, May 18, 2012 5:21 PM (31 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Although I haven't seen it, I recognize this as "Captivity" starring Elisha Cuthbert of "24" fame. And my understanding is that this movie tries to engage in a super duper plot twist and falls flat on its face. The movie was also infamous for a controversy involving its billboard advertisements.

see, Stevie, that's why I have concluded Satantango is not a great film (after a 2nd viewing this winter).

Ohhh yeah, I remember those billboards. They were pretty awful.

Also, KJB, re: favorites and masterpieces, I pretty consciously avoid any overt attempts at objective "quality" when I put together my ballots for these polls largely because, as you mention, there's an inherent subjectivity lurking behind all attempts to present one's own take on The Greatest Anything. All I can root for in good conscience is the stuff that has affected me personally and then try not to give too much of a rip whether it has more detractors than proponents. I'll be the first to recognize that my picks don't usually align with the canon or general critical approval, but I really don't care as that was never my intention in the first place.

That is a healthy attitude.

Idk, I enjoy a lot of banal and mediocre things that I'd have a hard time calling great

there's often a certain amount of back-and-forth on GOAT threads about whether or not it makes sense to distinguish between things that are "genuinely great" and not-great things that one happens to like for whatever reason. i think it does make sense to consider the distinction, but not to be bound by it.

call me an idiot, but i enjoyed haute tension more than inside or martyrs. i even liked the conclusion, despite the fact that it's patently ridiculous. there's a long point-of-view shot near the end in which the protagonist follows a half-seen car down a foggy road at night while romantic dreampop music plays. i realized during this shot that i was watching something deliberately unrealistic, that the film was trying to make a virtue of dreamlike atmosphere, of heightened and evocative incoherence. having grasped this, i wasn't asking for the ensuing wrap-up to make much sense; i just wanted it to be colorful and interesting. it was, so i was satisfied.

stepping back, i realize that my take on the film is personal and may have nothing to do with the filmmakers' intent. maybe it's just generic slasher movie with a dumb twist ending that i manufactured a "poetic" justification for. even if that's true, it doesn't matter to me and doesn't affect my evaluation of the film. my personal experience of it is enough to justify my fondness for it. if i'd liked it enough, i'd have voted for it, and i wouldn't have worried a bit about whether or not it's truly great enough to merit the inclusion.

^ redundant, i guess, in view of what deric just said

did want to thank KJB for this paragraph, the best thing anyone's said about genre itt (emphasis mine):

I do think that the arguments about boundaries in this thread (and others like it, I presume) reveal a misunderstanding about genre because genre is more a perpetual activity than a thing per se, more a verb than a noun. As Rick Altman puts it, "genres must be seen as a site of struggle among users" (in Film/Genre, p. 99). Or here's a juicier quote: "Whereas no critical discourse, however prestigious and oft repeated, can become part of Hamlet, even the lowliest of genre critics cannot help but contribute to the genre itself" (84).

That said, I'm always trying to take in positive critical takes on various things to gauge what might be worth a look-see, so (as I said before) I'm always happy to see ILX poll results that are surprising and filled with things I haven't seen/heard of/read. 'Cuz I largely trust the intention and thoughtfulness underlying y'all's taste, even if my tastes don't always align with those of the ILX massive.

Rick Altman was my advisor in college.

And he was HORRIFYING!!! There, better?

Actually, a big project of mine in Altman's class was analyzing the sound effects of the Leslie Neilson segment of CREEPSHOW. aaaand scene.

:D

martyrs kinda killed a certain kind of movie for me. after watching it, i definitely remember feeling like "well, that certainly closes a chapter in 21st-centur horror flicks." not that they'll stop coming, but i mean, why bother?

Wow, Thnig. That sounds awesome. I'm mildly obsessed with the voice effect Romero used for the water zombies. And the one used for Nathan Grantham's voice. And the sound of Nathan Grantham pulling himself out of the soil. And pretty much every single use of sound in that movie.

also shaun of the dead is the only "oh, you fuckers" for me today, but not because "it's not horror."

Anybody want to help a brother out and do a today recap? Currently posting from an iPhone so you don't need to worry abt a long boring tirade or anything.

yeah Shaun of the Dead is clearly a horror movie (albeit of the comedy variety) I just don't think it's that good.

xp

70. Let's Scare Jessica to Death
69. Cemetary Man
68. Cure
67. Hour of the Wolf
66. The Innocents
65. Mulholland Drive
64. Gremlins
63. Shaun of the Dead
62. Frankenstein
61. M
60. Vampyr
59. Cat People (1942)
58. Martyrs
57. Bride of Frankenstein
56. The Vanishing

plus lots of arguments about what does/doesn't belong here

No more results until Monday, right?

I defended the presence of M, other people stood up for Gremlins, Morbz complained about old shit getting the shaft, retread of torture-porn debate re: Martyrs, the end

xp

You forgot the part where we all reached consensus on a working definition of "horror".

oh right. high fives all around!

xp - that about covers it, yeah, plus intermittent grousing about arty shit and a long but useful kjb truthbomb

Deric--me too, those exact 2 same zombie voices in Creepshow have always fascinated me. They're so, I dunno, gargley. xpost

who voted for Shaun of the Dead btw? I like zombie comedies and this one was okay, but it didn't seem particularly inventive, nor did it have the manic energy of DeadAlive or Evil Dead 2

I did. I think it's great and that it works on a number of levels, almost the least of which is as a zombie movie (which, I gathered, was sort of the point). So it was a little lower on my ballot.

Full recap:

056. The Vanishing [Spoorloos] [1988, 326 points, 11 votes]
057. The Bride of Frankenstein [1935, 326 points, 9 votes]
058. Martyrs [2008, 319 points, 10 votes]
059. Cat People [1942, 316 points, 12 votes]
060. Vampyr [1932, 314 points, 8 votes]

061. M [1931, 312 points, 9 votes, 1 first-place vote]
062. Frankenstein [1931, 301 points, 13 votes]
063. Shaun of the Dead [2004, 301 points, 11 votes]
064. Gremlins [1984, 299 points, 12 votes]
065. Mulholland Drive [2001, 299 points, 9 votes]
066. The Innocents [1961, 298 points, 10 votes]
067. Hour of the Wolf [Vargtimmen] [1968, 292 points, 10 votes]
068. Cure [Kyua] [1997, 289 points, 9 votes]
069. Cemetery Man [Dellamorte Dellamore] [1994, 288 points, 8 votes, 1 first-place vote]
070. Let's Scare Jessica to Death [1971, 272 points, 11 votes]

071. Henry: Portrait of a Serial Killer [1986, 272 points, 10 votes]
072. Curse of the Demon [Night of the Demon] [1957, 261 points, 9 votes]
(tie). Drag Me To Hell [2009, 261 points, 9 votes]
074. Threads [1984, 251 points, 6 votes]
075. Creepshow [1982, 250 points, 10 votes]
(tie). Invasion Of The Body Snatchers [1956, 250 points, 10 votes]
077. Pan's Labyrinth [2006, 246 points, 9 votes]
078. Hellraiser [1987, 232 points, 10 votes]
079. Dead Ringers [1988, 228 points, 8 votes]
080. Nosferatu: Phantom der Nacht [1979, 226 points, 8 votes]

081. Duel [1971, 224 points, 8 votes]
082. Kwaidan [1964, 224 points, 6 votes, 1 first-place vote]
083. Picnic at Hanging Rock [1975, 220 points, 7 votes]
084. Near Dark [1987, 219 points, 10 votes]
085. Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With Me [1992, 218 points, 8 votes]
086. Witchfinder General [The Conqueror Worm] [1968, 209 points, 10 votes]
087. I Walked with a Zombie [1943, 208 points, 8 votes]
088. The Seventh Victim [1943, 206 points, 6 votes, 1 first-place vote]
089. Wolf Creek [2005, 205 points, 7 votes]
090. Dressed To Kill [1980, 202 points, 8 votes, 1 first-place vote]

091. Curse of the Cat People [1944, 200 points, 5 votes]
092. Onibaba [1964, 191 points, 7 votes]
093. Se7en [1995, 189 points, 10 votes]
094. Paranormal Activity [2007, 189 points, 7 votes]
095. The Cabin in the Woods [2012, 189 points, 6 votes]
096. May [2002, 186 points, 8 votes]
097. [rec] [2007, 178 points, 7 votes]
098. Blood on Satan's Claw [Satan's Skin] [1971, 177 points, 8 votes]
099. Pontypool [2008, 176 points, 7 votes]
100. Phantasm [1979, 175 points, 8 votes]

Ones from my ballot that have made it so far:

056. The Vanishing [Spoorloos] [1988, 326 points, 11 votes]
059. Cat People [1942, 316 points, 12 votes]
060. Vampyr [1932, 314 points, 8 votes]
062. Frankenstein [1931, 301 points, 13 votes]
067. Hour of the Wolf [Vargtimmen] [1968, 292 points, 10 votes]
074. Threads [1984, 251 points, 6 votes]
086. Witchfinder General [The Conqueror Worm] [1968, 209 points, 10 votes]
092. Onibaba [1964, 191 points, 7 votes]
098. Blood on Satan's Claw [Satan's Skin] [1971, 177 points, 8 votes]

I'm up to ten: The Vanishing (Spoorloos), Shaun of the Dead, Gremlins, Mulholland Drive, Henry: Portrait of a Serial Killer, Creepshow, Hellraiser, Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With Me, Seven, Phantasm.

who voted for Shaun of the Dead btw? I like zombie comedies and this one was okay, but it didn't seem particularly inventive, nor did it have the manic energy of DeadAlive or Evil Dead 2

i did not vote for SotD, but i don't think its appeal lies in invention or manic energy. it's more about performances, attention to character, charm and wit.

Creepshow, at #5 on my ballot, is the only one of my top 15 (i.e. the ones I'm really invested in) to make it thus far.

voted for these:

056. The Vanishing
066. The Innocents
077. Pan's Labyrinth
079. Dead Ringers
080. Nosferatu: Phantom der Nacht
084. Near Dark
085. Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With Me