2008 Primaries Thread 3: The Rejecting and Denouncening

Aaaaand with an hour before debate time:

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/usa/2008/04/ordinary_people_screw_em.html

In January 1995, as the Clintons were licking their wounds from the 1994 congressional elections, a debate emerged at a retreat at Camp David. Should the administration make overtures to working class white southerners who had all but forsaken the Democratic Party? The then-first lady took a less than inclusive approach. "Screw 'em," she told her husband. "You don't owe them a thing, Bill. They're doing nothing for you; you don't have to do anything for them."

Asked to respond, the Clinton campaign replied: "This quote differs from the recollection of others who were in the room at the time this comment was allegedly made." Asked to produce any witnesses who could back that up, the Clinton spokesman changed the subject. Classy.

whoah I walk away for a few minutes...

bye, hillary

there have been matriarchies? name one.

I'll grant that "matriarchy" is a hotly contested term, but if we use it to refer to societies where there were established traditions of women holding positions of political and economic power there are plenty of examples: Egyptian Kush dynasty, Nubia, southern India (Mangalore/Kerala - still in existence today!), various European states at various times, etc.

interesting timing

xp

so anyone know where/if the debate is going to be streamed online? abc doesn't seem to have a clear link, maybe i missed it.

let me know!

bye, hillary

don't worry, she's been "fully vetted"

mark, this seems be the local abc station's stream: http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/index
but, you might have to watch with the silly reaction graphs...

wow so according to huffpost youve got 3 people in the room who remember hillary saying that - best part is bill tried to talk her down w/a v obamaesque argument

thanks robot!

shall we have a separate debate thread?

wait when does debate start - am heading home now

now

what a fucking debate, first hour was pure BS

first hour was meaningless pain

there were flashes where I was reminded of everything I like about Hillary. Her answer on how to handle support for Israel by reassuring other middle eastern allies that they'd get the same American military support & response if they were to be attacked was totally lacking from Obama's somewhat content-free 'I promise you I will be tough' response. and she did her homework on her gun control answer for Pennslyvania and I was kind of shocked at how little Obama seemed to care about his answer on an issue that was so crucial for that audience, it just didn't matter to him. not smart!

her frustrated non-apology on the sniper thing reminded me of all the many long months that have passed since I liked Hillary

they gave her a pretty nice pass when she basically said "I lied, so what"

you could just see her seething that she was being forced to 'apologize' over such a trivial non-issue, right on the heels of her stressing the validity of the 'questions' about Obama's associations w/ Wright and argh Ayers

she's a machine and she fucking thrived in that poisonous first hour

It's not hard to "thrive" when all of the questions are directed at your opponent.

HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THE AMERICAN FLAG?
DOES REV WRIGHT LOVE AMERICA?
etc.

Embarrassing debate.

new low for America tonight, agreed.

yeah when jonah goldberg says your mod is spouting repub talking points you're in some shit

"Senator, two questions. Number one, do you think Reverend Wright loves America as much as you do?"

good lord.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/16/us/politics/16text-debate.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1

huh i just got xposted by myself somehow

after Obama repeats his theme that the campaign is obsessed with meaningless contentless talking points, and starts talking about how the US economy and how income inequality is worse than any time since the 20s:

MR. GIBSON: And Senator Obama, I want to do one more question, which goes to the basic issue of electability. And it is a question raised by a voter in Latrobe, Pennsylvania, a woman by the name of Nash McCabe. Take a look.

NASH MCCABE (Latrobe, Pennsylvania): (From videotape.) Senator Obama, I have a question, and I want to know if you believe in the American flag. I am not questioning your patriotism, but all our servicemen, policemen and EMS wear the flag. I want to know why you don't.

(Announcements.)

MR. GIBSON: Back to the Philadelphia Debate, the Democratic Debate, just less than a week now before the Pennsylvania primary.

And I would be remiss tonight if I didn't take note of the fact that today is the one-year anniversary of Virginia Tech. And I think it's fair to say that probably every American during this day, at one point or another, said a small prayer for the great people at that university and for those who died.

It also, I suspect, makes this an appropriate time to talk about guns.

"Nash, do I look like a fireman?"

haven't any older, non-starry-eyed Obama supporters shown up on the trail with YOU BET I'M BITTER signs?

And I think it's fair to say that probably every American during this day, at one point or another, said a small prayer for the great people at that university, except for the goddamn atheists, or people who don't have every school-shooting anniversary marked in red on their fucking calendar.

haha i know that part was like whaaa

George Stephanopolis: Senator Obama, if your wife were raped and killed by an American flag, would you salute it, burn it or lethally inject it?

http://i26.tinypic.com/2ce0tw5.jpg

obama on the debate:

I will tell you it does not get more fun than these debates. They are inspiring debates. I think last night we set a new record because it took us 45 minutes before we even started talking about a single issue that matters to the American people.

It took us 45 minutes — 45 minutes before we heard about health care, 45 minutes before we heard about Iraq, 45 minutes before we heard about jobs, 45 minutes before we heard about gas prices.

Now, I don’t blame Washington for this because that’s just how Washington is. They like stirring up controversies and getting us to play gotcha games and getting us to attack each other. And I’ve got to say Sen. Clinton looked in her element.

She was taking every opportunity to, you know, get a dig in there.... That’s all right, that’s her right, that’s her right to kind of twist the knife a little bit....
Look, I understand though, because that’s the textbook Washington campaign, because that’s the politics that’s been taught to be played, that’s the lesson that she had heard when the Republicans were doing the same things to her back in the 1990s.

http://politicalinquirer.com/2008/04/17/stephanopoulos-was-coached-by-hannity/

http://media.gallup.com/poll/graphs/041708DailyUpdateGraph1_nmjkou5.gif

http://thepage.time.com/2008/04/17/mccains-nerve-center/

MARK HALPERIN IS REALLY BORED TODAY DUDES

Among the things Davis tells The Page:

“I don’t have to use my glasses when I use the AARP calculator…since I turned 50 I’m qualified to have an AARP calculator so that’s totally extraordinary.”

“I do a lot of three-hole punching…I’m an active three-hole puncher. My world revolves around punching holes in things.”

Get an even closer look at Davis’ desk featured in this week’s TIME here.

Barack dusting his shoulders off: http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/04/17/sot.obama.criticizes.abc.debate.cnn

haha so awesome

summarize please? (I don't have sound)

It's the same as Mark Clemente's post upthread, Shakey, only a bit longer and with the coda that the people don't want that kind of politics and it's not gonna go that way this time.

About Last Night…
By Jeff Zeleny

RALEIGH, N.C. – Senator Barack Obama delivered a mocking critique of Wednesday night’s Democratic presidential debate, telling an audience here that the 90-minute session with Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton exemplified the problems with Washington by not focusing on issues that truly matter to the American people.
“They like stirring up controversy and they like playing gotcha games, getting us to attack each other. And I have to say Senator Clinton looked in her element,” Mr. Obama said. “She was taking every opportunity to get a dig in there. You know, that’s all right. That’s her right. That’s her right to kind of twist the knife a little bit.”
At a town meeting today in North Carolina, where he arrived to campaign in advance of the May 6 primary, Mr. Obama seemed intent on seeking to quell any political fallout from the debate in Philadelphia. Throughout much of the ABC News forum, Mr. Obama was on the defensive, tackling questions about his patriotism, understanding of small-town America and his association with the incendiary remarks of his former pastor.
“That was the roll-out of the Republican campaign against me in November. That is what they will do,” Mr. Obama said. “They will try to focus on all these issues that don’t have anything to do with how you pay your bills at the end of the month.”

With a wide smile, and a sarcastic tone, Mr. Obama sought to brush aside criticism about his performance in what he said was the 21st debate of the presidential nominating fight.
“I will tell you, it does not get much more fun than these debates. They are inspiring events,” Mr. Obama quipped. “Last night, I think we set a new record because it took us 45 minutes before we even started talking about a single issue that matters to the American people. It took us 45 minutes!”
“Forty-five minutes before we heard about health care. Forty-five minutes before we heard about Iraq,” he continued. “Forty-five — 45 — minutes before we heard about jobs. Forty-five minutes before we heard about gas prices.”
While many admirers of Mr. Obama have aggressively assailed the debate’s moderators, Charlie Gibson and George Stephanopoulos, Mr. Obama did not mention them in his remarks today. Instead, he focused his ire on Mrs. Clinton.
“Look, I understand that because that’s the text book Washington game. That’s how our politics has been taught to be played,” Mr. Obama said. “That’s the lesson that she learned when the Republicans were doing that same thing to her back in the 1990s. So I understand it and when you’re running or the presidency than you’ve got to expect it.”
He told the audience that he intended to let the criticism roll off of him. As he spoke, he made a dramatic gesture of wiping off his sleeves and dusting off his dark suit.
“That’s what you got to do,” he said, drawing loud applause from the audience. “That’s what you’ve got to do. But understand this, that is also precisely why I’m running for president – to change that kind of politics.”
After Mr. Obama’s opening remarks, a woman in the audience asked how he intended to forcefully challenge Senator John McCain, the presumptive Republican nominee.
“It’s a little hard to do with a fellow Democrat. I’m trying to show some restraint. I won’t have as much restraint with the Republicans,” Mr. Obama said, adding: “That’s the debate that I am really looking forward to. I am confident that that’s the debate the American people are going to want to have.”
“What they are going to figure out is who is the person who can lead this country and actually solve problems,” he added. “We’ve been going through this politics – tit for tat silliness – for decades now.”

haa animated gif plz xD

haha awesome

http://www.artistdirect.com/Images/Sources/AMGCOVERS/music/cover200/dri100/i198/i19824oqb34.jpg

I've been busy for a few days - has this been discussed yet? do we care?

The comments on that article make me want to hit my head against a wall.

xpost not even going to read them

You're also right that I would not want my first term consumed by what was perceived on the part of Republicans as a partisan witch hunt because I think we've got too many problems we've got to solve.

Now I know he was responding very specifically to a question about whether or not he would prosecute Bush admin torture architects, but isn't one of the "many problems we've got to solve" the fact that we're torturing people in the first place? The fact that the administration has changed military procedures to allow torture? Have we seen a clear statement from either Dem candidate on reversing these moves?

wait til fox starts telling everybody over 40 years old that obama was giving props to a rapper and u know hes a bad man cause he uses profanity- just watch this LEWD VIDEO WITH GYRATING HIPS AND SHADY PEOPLE *fox plays clip of 'dirt of your shlder'*

"sen obama, how long have been a friend of jayz and does he love america?"

^ i would not be surprised in the least if this happened

Liberals- "WATER BOARDING- OH NOOOOOOOO!!!!" .. Chopping off people's heads, using gas, burning them alive, burning them with irons, hanging them from the ceiling, cutting off their hands... . . That's Ok- those poor Al Quaeda terrorists are just misunderstood- they probably had bad parents. . . "HATE AMERICA FIRST" What a a great group of Liberals..