Worst commissioner of the three major (American) sports

Stern not even close.

BIG HOOPS aka the sterndriver

Don't know much about the other two, but I'll vote for Selig based on the fact that, under his watch, the steroid issue completely overtook the sport in a way that will linger for another decade or two at a minimum--let's say until Ryan Braun comes up for HOF consideration, unless it never goes away. The sport seems to be in good shape financially right now, and there haven't been major labour-relations issues for a while, and those are significant points in Selig's favour. But for me, his initial slowness in dealing with steroids--just sort of hoping it went away, I think--dwarfs all. (Also didn't like the way he eased himself into the position.)

I detest Selig, but he has presided over booming business. And I don't give a shit about steroids.

Not voting bcz I don't watch the other sports (I'd rather the NFL didn't exist).

I know you personally don't care about them, but you must at least get tired of the issue automatically coming up when Bonds or the HOF or records or so much else is discussed. Seems to me that that could have been prevented.

Selig following the Marlins line re: Guillen this past week makes me hate him, but no, it's gotta be Stern. Tho I don't like the NBA so...

I'm only a casual basketball fan, but is this year's delayed season the reason people are so down on Stern, or is that just one of many issues? I know the NBA was viewed as the ideal business model for all sports if you go back to the Jordan era...which was quite a while ago, I realize.

yeah clemenza: kill sportswriters

I'm only a casual basketball fan, but is this year's delayed season the reason people are so down on Stern, or is that just one of many issues? I know the NBA was viewed as the ideal business model for all sports if you go back to the Jordan era...which was quite a while ago, I realize.

He vetoed a major trade.

And did a lot of lying about the reasons for it/how he did it

For years he's shown little interest in reforming terrible officiating, his dress code for players was kind of absurd, a lot of people seem to think he plays favorites.

I think it's wishful thinking to blame sportswriters for keeping the steroids issue alive--it's obviously a lightning rod for fans, and players hold court on it too.

Selig has points for and against, and it just depends how you weigh them. Kenesaw Mountain Landis acted swiftly and drastically after the 1919 World Series, and gambling was no longer an issue. At the same time, had the good luck of having Ruth come along. And he also largely did nothing to desegregate the sport, and often actively worked against it.

Basketball is still pretty much the same game it was 20 years ago. NFL is just a powerhouse organization that only gets bigger and better, no matter what problems it faces.

MLB though, from 1994 to now, has been an abandoned sandcastle. The wild card. The strike. The expansion teams. The disparity between the have's and the have-not's. Tying the All-Star game into the postseason. Rearranging the leagues and still having the NL West being what it is. THE GODDAM INTERLEAGUE PLAY FUCKING EVERYTHING UP. The steroids. The late starts. The season not concluding until after Election Day. I honestly could keep going.

Fuck Bud Selig. Fuck him in that wrinkled-up old vadge he calls a mouth.

^^ would agree, if ML baseball mattered any more.

See there? It once did!

Yeah, this is Bud Selig by MILES.

the vast majority of nhl teams are in america so i will vote gary bettman

There will be kids drafted over the next couple of years who weren't even born when MLB had a labor stoppage and every sport has had a more recent labor issue than baseball, sometimes two.
Interleague and the wild card are unquestionable successes.

Selig's a bastard but so are all sports commissioners. Baseball is healthier than any other point my lifetime, so I'm not that bothered by him anymore.

Basketball is still pretty much the same game it was 20 years ago. NFL is just a powerhouse organization that only gets bigger and better, no matter what problems it faces.

I dunno, the nfl is facing some pretty fundamental problems these days - people aren't talking about whether baseball or basketball should even be played - and it hasn't made inroads overseas

people aren't talking about whether baseball...should even be played

I'm talking about it, because it's boring as all fuck.

I dunno, the nfl is facing some pretty fundamental problems these days...and it hasn't made inroads overseas

Not necessarily true. NFL has a healthy following in the UK and when NFL Europe existed as sort of an expo/farm league, it drew crowds.

not the kinda crowds that create a sustainable business

MLB though, from 1994 to now, has been an abandoned sandcastle. The wild card. The strike. The expansion teams. The disparity between the have's and the have-not's. Tying the All-Star game into the postseason. Rearranging the leagues and still having the NL West being what it is. THE GODDAM INTERLEAGUE PLAY FUCKING EVERYTHING UP. The steroids. The late starts. The season not concluding until after Election Day. I honestly could keep going.

outside of the steroid thing I don't really think any of these are problems - is interleague play really that bad an idea?

would agree, if ML baseball mattered any more.

what exactly are your criteria for what matters? it's still a big deal

wtf else did the baseball people expect when they sold their souls to a tawdry Milwaukee used-car salesman?!?

The disparity between the have's and the have-not's.

This issue in baseball bothers me, but yes I know Yankees and Red Sox fans differ, and others may too

competitive inbalance is not as much of an issue in baseball - regardless of payroll or talent levels, there's so much variance in the game that even the best teams only win about 65%, and the WS is almost never won by the best team

That problem exists in all three leagues fwiw.

i do miss the days when the Pittsburgh Pirates and the Kansas City Royals were successful and competitive franchises.

not much Selig can do about incompetant management

The steroid scandal has wounded MLB very badly. Selig was instrumental in trying to sweep it under the rug and pretend it never happened.

competitive imbalance has been a part of baseball since day one
How did PEDs really wound MLB? Revenues, attendance and fantasy participation are higher than ever. It wounded baseball with useless sportswriters.

Seems like people always point to NFL ratings as proof of baseball's irrelevance and demise.

Well, yeah, there are 240 regular season NFL games every year. There are 2400 regular season MLB games.

The majority of the former on Sundays, making for perfect TV events.

There are 2400 regular season MLB games.

Part of the reason it's hard to give a fuck about the regular season. With the NFL, each week the tv audience congregates to watch a slate of games that have immediate implications toward division rankings. Nobody watches baseball on tv until the post-season because hardly any game during the regular season ever matters. Baseball (at least in the regular season) has become a sport you see played live rather than watch on tv.

Lots of people watch baseball on TV. That's why the Dodgers recently became the most valuable franchise in all of sports.

generally, the only times i pay attention during the baseball season are the 1st and last months, and when favored teams play hated rivals (phillies v. mutts, yankees v. red suxx).

bettman really deserves this

I'd rather listen to baseball on the radio than watch it (in part because my local team's radio crew has always been 1000x better than its TV crew), but I find football almost unwatchable on TV. It's boring as fuck, five seconds of action followed by 40 seconds of nothing followed by 2 minutes of commercials.

Bettman wins by default, given that it's his fault hockey is only barely a 'major' sport

The Dodgers just got bought for $2 bil, and the woeful Padres are about to get purchased for something like 700mil. Just because you dudes don't enjoy watching regular season baseball doesn't mean people aren't watching. The Giants fans in SF are like a virus. They're everywhere! GO AWAY

Nobody watches baseball on tv until the post-season

Well, nobody watches every game but tons of people watch on TV. You also have to consider radio listeners, as MLB is the only sport that really works on the radio

bettman really deserves this

yes yes yes

The Giants fans in SF are like a virus. They're everywhere! GO AWAY

lol. how dare there be fans of the hometown team?

selig with a bullet. mlb's flourished as a business but he's a repulsive old toad who consistently makes infuriating decisions

i like stern because of his cool gangster ass 'tude.

I will say MLB's technology/blackout policies drive me up a fuckin' wall, I really fail to understand how blocking Youtube videos and preventing mlb.tv customers from watching their OWN TEAMS could possibly increase revenue

I find football almost unwatchable on TV. It's boring as fuck, five seconds of action followed by 40 seconds of nothing followed by 2 minutes of commercials.

― Kiarostami bag (milo z), Saturday, April 14, 2012 2:20 PM (9 minutes ago) Bookmark

go back to russia motherfucker

The latter seems to be hostility from decrepit old owners and the people they have TV contracts with. Regional television is where all the money comes from for now.

the existence of mlb.tv and being able to stream it via Boxee/etc. is still miles ahead of the NFL and NBA

I don't think Goodell is getting enough run here. The NFL would be number 1 in America with or without him. The players despise him. I guess he managed to avoid missing games this season but that lockout was ridiculous to begin with given that the league is awash in money.

football is the best tv sport because w/ so much going on at once you pretty much need replays

im cool with goodell after he came down hard on those cheating god damn saints. teach those animals a lesson rodge!!!!

poly otm, Goddell always struck me as a bully who wants the fans to believe that the only way to make the game safer is through a confusing, inconsistant system of fines and penalties that do little outside of increasing the league's revenue and baffling the players to that point where they have no idea what is a legal hit anymore

plus you got that 18-game schedule thing, christ

well his bigger problem is that there isn't really a way to make the game safer

Also the 18 game thing has been tabled for the foreseeable future.

Did the NFL player's union express an opinion about paying bounties for causing injuries? My guess is that there's no way in hell they could endorse that idea or even stay neutral on it.

right, so what the NFL needs is more money put into pensions for retired players and research into player safety and less of this "the game is unsafe because James Harrison is a cheating monster" mentality xp

I'm not a huge Goodell fan by any means, but given that about every aspect of the NFL game today is different than it's ever been with regard to popularity, player behavior, owner behavior, coach behavior, the rushing river of $$$, media spotlight, soap operas, etc he's doing an okay job despite going in blind.

Also the 18 game thing has been tabled for the foreseeable future.

still had to listen Goddell pretend he had no idea what the difference was between a preseason game and a regular season game

well his bigger problem is that there isn't really a way to make the game safer

― iatee, Saturday, April 14, 2012 2:38 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark

knee-high grass on every field. boom. safer game.

Oh shit, I'd watch that!

Goddell always struck me as a bully who blah blah blah blah blah blah

Quit misspelling his name please, you're making me irrationally angry.

Nobody watches baseball on tv until the post-season because hardly any game during the regular season ever matters.

This is hooey, JF -- I watch about 5-6 games a week and listen to another 3-5 on Gameday Audio or with the tv on in the background. (Working from home

Yeah, i'll cop to that being hooey. I'm working with a very small sample size (me, my immediate family, and my own perceptions). lol

I'm enjoying the Yankees getting mashed into tomato paste right now!

god i can't choose all of these guys are terrible

stern is prob my fave for sentimental reasons but he should have hung it up a while ago

goodell seems like the worst on a personal level, like one of the few human beings i would be unwilling to have a conversation with

Worst of these 3, I'd say Stern>Goodell>Selig, which is not to praise Selig at all.

sometimes you hear fans of mlb/nba/nhl muttering darkly about conspiracies that give big-market/popular television teams an edge through officiating or whatever.

the nba is the only one i actually believe this about.

isn't there some evidence for this happening w/ stars? vaguely remember reading about it

I don't think it's a conspiracy, I just think Stern is happy to let officiating suck until fans start turning away from the game because of it.

sometimes its subconscious even

favorite part of basketball games is when a star has obviously committed a foul, but one of his lesser teammates immediately raises their hand to take credit

i don't watch much nba, but i saw game six of the kings-lakers series live in 2002.

also didn't stern once decree -- in the middle of the season -- that the first round of that year's playoffs would suddenly be best-of-7 rather than best-of-5?

not much Selig can do about incompetant management

― you can expect punches, kicks and even worse (frogbs), Saturday, April 14, 2012 6:03 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

they could enforce a salary floor and a salary cap. But apparently the baseball public likes the competitive imbalance (I don't necessarily disagree with them.)

it's still amazingly balanced compared to euro sports

the NFL's competitive balance seems to have made the game bigger than ever though, so I dunno what would happen

I have a hard time considering the NFL to be facing serious problems. Like 40 of the 50 most valuable sports franchises on earth are NFL teams. Injuries are just something people idly worry about during the 8 hours a day they're thinking about the NFL.

a lot could change very quickly w/ lawsuits and they're 40 of the 50 most valuable spots franchises on earth because it's america's biggest sport and america has a lot of money. but more people on the planet earth know who jeremy lin is than eli manning.

venus otoh

NFL needs a Chinese-American QB

I think the NFL is dancing on the edge of a dropoff in popularity similar to boxing's decline, due to an inherent viciousness in the sport that can't be ignored or rationalized for too many more years. I'm totally guessing, though.

MLB though, from 1994 to now, has been an abandoned sandcastle. The wild card. The strike. The expansion teams.

Just as a matter of survival, I'm not sure wild cards and (further) expansion could have been avoided. I'd also say that last year proves that the wild card doesn't preclude a wild and unforgettable finish to the season (admittedly, it was a perfect storm that won't be duplicated soon).

they could enforce a salary floor and a salary cap. But apparently the baseball public likes the competitive imbalance (I don't necessarily disagree with them.)

― Matt Armstrong, Saturday, April 14, 2012 3:36 PM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I feel like the big tipping point with boxing's popularity in America is that American kids stopped doing it (and started playing football.) But it seems like high school football is as big as ever. xp

err I guess that's not really a tipping point and more of a trend sry

"they could enforce a salary floor and a salary cap."

How in god's name could they do this? Do you not understand that there is a Players Union?

would you let your kids play football? xp

yeah i don't think football is going anywhere, particularly now that so many people (advertisers, corporations, etc) are dumping huge dollars into high school football.

How in god's name could they do this? Do you not understand that there is a Players Union?

― Fig On A Plate Cart (Alex in SF), Saturday, April 14, 2012 7:57 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol, the NFL, NHL and NBA have players unions too.

I've talked about this with friends - I'd rather my kid boxed up through Golden Gloves than played high school football. Football and rugby would be last on the list of things I'd want progeny to play.

now that ownership groups are paying 2b for franchises (in a bad economy!) I think you'll see MLB have a financial crisis and an ensuing salary cap pretty soon even with their PLAYERS UNION

hs and college football are even more problematic than the nfl. espn and nike making money from an unpaid 15 y/o getting concussions is not a long-term biz model really

the NHL and NBA were in dire straits when the got capped, the NFL has all teams coming close to the cap so players agreed (I think it involved the move to free agency as well). MLB teams are rolling in the dough and has the strongest union. Hard to foresee them working out a cap.

Competitive balance has far less to do with the NFL's popularity than it being the perfect TV event sport. People like dynasties - the 49ers in the '80s, Cowboys of the early '90s, Patriots of the '00s

one ownership group paid $2b because they bought a team in the second-largest media market in the country and will make metric fuck-tons of money with a regional sports network

The Rangers hadn't won a playoff game until two years ago and signed a TV deal for $1.6bn. Imagine what successful teams are going to get over the next decade!

I am skeptical of baseball teams all of a sudden discovering billions of dollars each in a revenue stream based on cable TV.

uh... why? Cable revenues are precisely why the Yankees and Red Sox have more money than anyone else. Texas and the Angels just signed billion-plus deals. The Dodgers will probably rival the Yankees/Sox in cable revenue with a new deal.

Stern not even close.

― Fig On A Plate Cart (Alex in SF), Saturday, April 14, 2012 10:50 AM (5 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

My hatred of Bettman is mostly legacy @ this point. He seems to not be as in the public eye as he used to be and that's a good thing. I still would love to see him in front of a firing line but...

Selig is basically Don Knotts. Grossly incompetent but benign at his core and the worst things he's done (All-Star Game; God Bless America) are p easily undoable. Interleague was something that was going to happen as soon as they gathered AL and NL under one banner anyway.

Goddell's track record is too short compared to the other guys.

Which laves Stern, who is pretty clearly crooked, talks to much and integrity of the game blah blah blah

Are teams still doing God Bless America? The Rangers are back to singing Deep In the Heart of Texas.

So for years and years cable companies were just letting baseball teams skate by with small broadcast fees? I don't get where the explosion in money is. It seems like a bubble to me.

NYY and Miami to name two. I'm sure others do as well. IIRC in houston you get GBA, TMOTTBG AND DITHOT

selig has the power to do something about length of games and (maybe) umpiring which are the things that will sink baseball eventually imo

but he couldn't be bothered i guess

My favourite incompetent commissioner was of course Bowie Kuhn. Bumbled through the '70s--an amazing decade on the field, and I'm pretty sure financially, too--making one bad decision after another. On the other hand, he laid the groundwork for all the labour acrimony of the '80s and into 1994.

It seems like a bubble to me.

I disagree, I think people will pay top dollar for their own anesthesia.

"lol, the NFL, NHL and NBA have players unions too."

Largely broken, power-less players unions.

the nhl players have hired donald fehr, but the league just doesn't make the kind of money that nfl/mlb do.

Largely broken, power-less players unions.

― Fig On A Plate Cart (Alex in SF), Saturday, April 14, 2012 8:30 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

not buying the myth of the unstoppable, unbreakable MLB players union. They haven't hit on some secret solidarity that NBA and NFL players can't find.

I'm not saying they are unstoppable or unbreakable. I'm just saying this idea that Selig could unilaterally establish a floor/cap is nonsense. Also baseball would probably lose an entire season if they even tried it right now.

I said "they" could enforce a salary cap. And they could, based on what other sports have done. But they don't seem to care about competitive balance.

what need is there for a salary cap when they're raking in money and no one seems to care about wastelands like the Royals? It's all just a farm system for the 8 or 9 teams that are trying to compete.

"And they could, based on what other sports have done."

They could IF they were willing to lose a season at the very least and quite probably destroy the sport for a decade. But I guess that's less important to you than "competitive balance".

ewwww, Bowie Kuhn.

They could IF they were willing to lose a season at the very least and quite probably destroy the sport for a decade. But I guess that's less important to you than "competitive balance".

― Fig On A Plate Cart (Alex in SF), Saturday, April 14, 2012 8:43 PM (21 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

why the quotes

and yes I would be willing to lose a season of MLB for a league that has competitive balance.

Well thankfully so far the owners haven't been as short-sighted as you are.

There's lots of things I hate about baseball (high ticket prices, gouging taxpayers for stadiums, a generally terrible TV product) but I'm perfectly happy with how the league is structured right now. Most of the teams that are not competitive are not competitive because they are run badly (Blue Jays might be the one exception). I don't see how a salary cap changes that. It just reduces the salaries of the best players and forces the Yankees and the Red Sox to spend less (or pay a hefty luxury tax to shits like Jeffrey Loria.)

there are 6 teams that have less than a third of the yankees' payroll. This isn't because they are "run badly," it's because their owners are cheap/lack the cashflow.

I mean if you want to fold all those teams that's ok too

one of those teams is the rays

they are an anomaly, tho

The people who think there isn't any competitive balance in baseball obviously haven't noticed that about 25 of the 30 teams have made the playoffs in the past decade. Also the past eleven World Series have been won by nine different teams.

And before you complain that Selig has ruined the game and baseball doesn't matter any more, consider that the LA Dodgers, who were a horribly-run team with disastrous finances and the shittiest baseball owner we've seen in our lifetimes, were just sold for two fucking billion dollars. I never liked Selig but you can't dispute that baseball have never been healthier financially. Attendance has been through the roof on his watch too.

Another write-in vote for Bettman.

Look at what the Yankees have spent that payroll on though! It's not like overspending is some guarantee to success. You still have to scout, build a farm system, actually have a real organization. Also since you'll never see those teams balance sheets... well let's say I'm kinda dubious about the poverty of baseball team owners. And I think baseball is good for having a team as easily despicable as the Yankees (just like it benefits the NBA and the Premier League). Star teams are a big draw. That's comparatively lacking in the parity of the NFL for the most part.

The people who think there isn't any competitive balance in baseball obviously haven't noticed that about 25 of the 30 teams have made the playoffs in the past decade. Also the past eleven World Series have been won by nine different teams.

well the playoffs are partly crapshooty and the correlation is a lot more clearcut if you only look at regular season results

I mean you can really put a lot of the 'competitive balance' on the playoff system of these sports that allows worse teams the chance to 'win the season'

At one point the KC Royals had an outfield of Beltran, Sweeney, Dye and Damon. Farm system.

btw, being willing to give up an entire season to restore competitive balance is the opposite of short-sighted.

It's mostly just moronic.

You do realize that teams generally have to field players other than outfielders, right?

dude they ended up keeping only one of them because they didn't spend the money

what do you think the yankees would have done?

Probably overpaid for them.

Signing Jermaine Dye didn't do the A's much good.

well the playoffs are partly crapshooty and the correlation is a lot more clearcut if you only look at regular season results

Outside of the Yankees and Red Sox (each of whom have missed the playoffs recently), the playoffs have largely been a revolving door of teams over the past few years.

And yeah, using the Royals as a counterexample to "prove" something about competitive balance in MLB is silly, it's like pointing at the LA Clippers and saying that some NBA teams aren't getting a fair shake.

the yankees have missed the playoffs once in the last, what, 16 years? it certainly helps that they're well-run and god knows the mets/cubs/etc. have not done well despite financial advantages (though there's still a significant gap between the yankees and second). but it means that the yanks can absorb a fuckup like carl pavano or aj burnett that would bury other teams.

fwiw aj burnett is, i believe, the highest-paid player in pittsburgh sports history, although much of it is coming from the yankees.

i'm not saying that there should be a hard cap, but let's not brush over the fact that spending $200m will almost certainly get you into the playoffs.

The Clippers for decades failed to draft good talent. The Royals drafted good talent and let them go.

the royals have the best farm system in baseball right now, what do you think is gonna happen?

the royals have only dimly understood what talent is until v. recently, tbh

jeff francoeur's a great guy tho

toronto, baltimore, kc, washington, and pittsburgh are the five mlb teams that have basically been out of it come playoff time, but tbh i think toronto and wash are heading back to the postseason soon. so there are three teams that are perpetual losers and may be for years to come, though KC has obv promise. w/all those teams i think a lot of it has come down to terrible decision-making more than revenue.

but it means that the yanks can absorb a fuckup like carl pavano or aj burnett that would bury other teams

To me, this is the key. Once you cross some hard-to-define line, you may take forever coming back. Conceding the Jays are in a tough division, they've been stuck at the same impasse for 21 years now: they can't compete for Albert Pujols because they don't draw enough, they don't draw enough because they're never in pennant races anymore, and they're never in pennant races anymore because they can't compete for the Albert Pujols's of the world. They let a wildly successful team get a little too old at one point, and they haven't come back since. I have to believe that the luxury of over-spending in the off-season would have got them back on the right side of that line years ago.

Tampa Bay is a heartening exception right now. We'll see how long they can stay where they are.

i can see the jays and rays being the 1-2 punch in the al east in a couple of years, though it won't be easy. feel like the yanks and esp. the bosox are on the cusp of possibly being mediocre for several seasons. depends on how they roll in free agency but imo those are squads that could collapse at any time.

My math needs some work. Twenty one years ago was 1991; the Jays had a couple of pretty successful years after that.

Uh hay u guys, the average win % for MLB teams is .500 -- competitive balance!

So for years and years cable companies were just letting baseball teams skate by with small broadcast fees? I don't get where the explosion in money is. It seems like a bubble to me.

The Royals argument here is coming down more along the lines of punishing players - the Royals lost them because they got six years of major league service at below-market rates and then lost them to teams that were willing to pay market rates.

It's worth remembering that teams get a lot of time with young players before they're free agents - for great players, that's the age 27/28 season, for good players it's often age 31/32, when players are already declining. Outside of a few players (Poooooo-holes, etc.), free agency is a pretty shitty way to build a winning team. And even those players hold the risk of sinking the team they sign with near the end of the contract (Poooooo-holes again).

"the royals have the best farm system in baseball right now, what do you think is gonna happen?"

Screw it up! That's because they are the ROYALS! Not because they can't afford them.

a few years old, but includes the average age of free agents signing long deals: http://baseballanalysts.com/archives/2006/03/longterm_free_a.php
pitchers: 31.6
hitters: 30.5

those players were drafted at age 17-22, that's a lot of time to be tied up in the minors, on rookie-through-third-year contracts (teams get to decide what to give you out of the goodness of their hearts) and arbitration (which is better but still players much less than they could offering their services openly).

if anything is broken about baseball, it's the system that keeps the top-level young talent in the minors to save time/money for the team, IMO
Bryce Harper is terrible in AAA right now, but the whole game is more interesting if he had been given a real chance of making the team in Spring Training

Jays are probably the one example of a team that is really really screwed currently, but either the Red Sox or the Yankees could fall apart at any time. Having a slew of money /= running a team well as 80s/early 90s Yankees proved all too well.

the Red Sox are in the process of falling apart already

the history of teams that had the highest payroll (or close) is pretty interesting, especially when you look at how many fucked it up with their signings (ie Albert Belle in Baltimore, everyone the Rangers signed before Tom Hicks went broke, etc.)

worth pointing out, too, that major league owners have no real interest in instituting a cap right now, since even the fuckin' Pirates are profitable

http://www.stevetheump.com/Payrolls.htm

thought I'd seen one that goes all the way back through the '90s, but I can't find it

Harper's a poor example though. I mean they are pushing him about as hard as a prospect can be reasonably pushed at the age of 19. I guarantee you if the Nats thought he was actually really ready, he wouldn't be in AAA right now--they'd be selling tickets off him in DC instead.

Big sigh, Jays fans:

http://content.usatoday.com/sportsdata/baseball/mlb/salaries/team/1993

(You can get payrolls back to '88 there.)

Having a slew of money /= running a team well as 80s/early 90s Yankees proved all too well.

the yankees didn't really bust out the big money until the early 2000s

they went from $93m in 2000 to $153m in 2003 to $184m in 2004 to $208m in 2005. that year, only one team spent *half* as much -- the red sox at $124m. they spent $20m more than the indians, brewers, pirates, royals and rays combined. it can't buy you a world series, but spending twice as much as everyone else can definitely buy you a playoff berth.

the angels and rangers seem to be catching up money-wise now that steinbrenner's heirs have reined in payroll (or at least not let it continue to grow). but i could be a pretty good gm with that kind of money too.

the Rangers' payroll jumped a bunch this year because of Darvish and players hitting arbitration, it was pretty impressive to take $55 and $70mn payrolls (IIRC) to the Series back to back

NFL needs a Chinese-American QB

― Matt Armstrong, Saturday, April 14, 2012 3:48 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark

RIP timmy chang

baseball's competitive balance is fine right now but i highly doubt that it's sustainable. the new cba is going to be a big step in making it so--watching the sox and the yanks scramble to get their salaries in order this past offseason was the major signal that things are going to be different from now on.

http://randomoverload.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/38f51f42se-traveler.jpg

he throws a football about as well as a 19th century Chinaman.

people aren't talking about whether baseball...should even be played

I'm talking about it, because it's boring as all fuck.

nope, it's just you

I find football almost unwatchable on TV. It's boring as fuck, five seconds of action followed by 40 seconds of nothing followed by 2 minutes of commercials.

and that "action" is boring. It's the sport this country deserves.

Please sum up the strategy in baseball beyond versatile pitchers and power hitters, because outside of those things I don't see any. Football is all strategy from kickoff to the final tick of the clock.

There's more shit going on in basketball, hockey, and soccer than in baseball. I'd put tennis on baseball's level strategy-wise, but even tennis is more fun to watch because it's person vs. person.

hahaha have you got about 25 years?

we could talk about pitch selection for 5

beyond versatile pitchers and power hitters

I get the fact that the best pitchers can game the batter, and that's the most interesting aspect of baseball. Beyond that, though, it boils down to "should I or should I not attempt to steal third?"

we'll just have to agree that I have no idea what you're talking about.

also, the "worst" major-league pitchers 'game' the best batters all the time, which is why hitting a baseball is the hardest thing to do in sports.

I'm constantly amazed at the reaction times fielders have on the ball - to know in the split second after the ball leaves the bat where you need to be is something.

I've probably got a lifetime .400 record at bat and I suck.

.400 ops?

Yeah, but my sample size is really small. One season of little league and some intramural games in college.

How many runs created per 27 outs, JF? What's your BABIP? WAR? Win Probability Added? We need a fuller picture.

really good point made above, about how the Yankees massive payroll isn't necessarily an advantage because they can sign the best players (as it's rare to get a top 5 player in free agency - most players peak in their 5th or 6th season of team control), but rather because the bad contracts won't kill them. I remember reading something about how the Brewers could have been a force from 2005 until now, had they not signed Jeff Suppan to a long-term contract. Because one thing led to another, and another, and suddenly they couldn't afford certain players, etc. etc. In about 2 or 3 years A-Rod is going to be the worst contract in baseball and the Yankees will still go on. But if you think high payroll automatically means success, look at what's happened to the Cubs (the Yankees, with their astronomical payroll, are an exception)

Goddell is by far the worst here of a trio of fools.

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

Remarkably uninteresting results. How odd that it should be so.

i can't make a logical case for it but goodell is not getting his due

logical case: head trauma is leaps and bounds a more important issue than steroids (big source of Selig's bad rap) and Goodell actively ignored the issue, tried to move to an 18-game season while talking about player safety and has now taken to demonizing the kind of players the NFL built a lot of popularity around rather than making a real attempt to fix the systemic issues?

goodell is evil, but such is the nature of his position

the other dudes more obviously suck, unless you're a shareholder

well the difference between head trauma and steroids is that you really can't get rid of the former, but I don't want to defend Goodell and his intentional misunderstanding of the issue

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7881228/players-nfl-commissioner-roger-goodell-toughest-critics

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1085526/Animation15.gif

the fact that Goodell got only 3 votes in this makes me want to puke

give him time, bill

Goodell is Mussolini; Selig and Stern are Hitler and Stalin. all three are contemptible assholes who never should be allowed to hold any responsible office, but it's a question of degree of assholery.

or to be less inflammatory -- Goodell is Mitt Romney; Selig and Stern are Gingrich and Santorum.

goodell is doing a pretty bang up job imo. new cba was solid work.

I loathe the man. I am happy they got a deal done so we didnt miss a season (that would have been a nitemare) but he really sucks. Making one guy judge, jury and executioner is a total joke.

I may have to change my vote.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGIr3i2Unu4

And if you hate Jim Rome, fine. But ask yourself who you hate worse at the end of this clip?

RE-DO THIS FUCKING POLL

at least some instant replay

Hahaha, it would probably come out the exact same way, if we have any replacement mods running this joint.

the fact that Goodell got only 3 votes in this makes me want to puke

― One Way Ticket on the 1277 Express (Bill Magill), Tuesday, May 8, 2012 2:49 PM (4 months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

give him time, bill

― call all destroyer, Tuesday, May 8, 2012 2:54 PM (4 months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Can I take my bow now? If this poll was taken now, it should be a shutout and Goddell should win. The guy is utterly incompetent. Also a Nazi

This ref thing is fucking amazing to me. As a Bears fan I want to do nothing but chuckle hardily at the Packers throwing away a game in the final seconds, but not like this.

lol bill i just came here to copy/paste that exchange

who knew it would take Roger Goddell ruining football to get me to start watching it regularly again? I am spending every game waiting for the exasperated, crestfallen cries of discontent from the announcers about how the replacement refs are destroying America and I don't think I've ever had so much delight watching ie the Jets come from behind to win (although Tebow getting beaned in the head with the ball was a factor there as much as the terrible refs)

also this is totally against the spirit of the sport but anything that screws over the Packers is automatically awesome to me

at the end of the day I think I just like carnivals, which is what the NFL currently is

http://gif.mocksession.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/REPLACEMENT-REF.gif

http://www.pigskinbuzz.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/replacement-ref-kevin-ogletree-trips-hat.gif

looooooool

^^^^^^ obv terrible, but also the funniest fucking thing

I mean why did that even happen

fuck wearing a hat

fear of a black hat

What does he slip on? A cap?

yes

apparently refs will throw their hat if a receiver steps out of bounds and is ineligible, but dude never really got close to the sideline and clearly stayed in bounds, so it really looks like the ref was just all "fuck it, gonna throw my hat under his feet *fling*"

COMEDY FOR EVERYONE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MK6TXMsvgQg

the refs havent screwed my team yet so im still enjoying it all. would happily vote for selig again

I know it's football and all but that gif is kind of worrisome; his slip comes out of nowhere, he puts a lot pressure on his left knee and ankle and lands awkwardly on his left leg with a lot of opportunity to screw that ankle, too.

http://data.whicdn.com/images/35360075/283_large.gif

Occupy Wall Street has a Facebook post today about how the NFL debacle shows "all our issues are connected" through the hiring of scabs.

anyway, best football season ever

Haha, yeah, this happened: As NFL Referees Lockout Continues, Gov. Scott Walker Calls For Return Of Unionized Refs

I know it's football and all but that gif is kind of worrisome; his slip comes out of nowhere, he puts a lot pressure on his left knee and ankle and lands awkwardly on his left leg with a lot of opportunity to screw that ankle, too.

― The windiest militant trash (Michael White), Tuesday, September 25, 2012 10:40 AM (6 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Agree. If that guy had gotten hurt, the players probably would have seriously considering walking out until the real refs were back due to unsafe working conditions. This is a disaster waiting to happen.

I'm still kinda hoping for a players walk-out.

Pretty sure I wound up a Goodell voter.

Players should just start calling the game themselves like pick-up basketball.

At the commissioner's press conference today, he appeared caught off guard by a question from 49ers tight end Vernon Davis: Why doesn't the league take care of its former players?

Goodell's scattershot answer included the notion that the healthcare benefits for current NFL players are "the best in the world." Past players? Not so much. Every NBA player who played from 2000-01 on receives some post-career benefits, and in MLB, all it takes is one day on an active roster to get lifetime coverage. But in the sport where they need it the most, NFL players (if they played three seasons) receive five years of healthcare after retirement, and then they're cut off.

the nfl players union deserves a lot of blame for this state of affairs, but man roger goodell is a prick

yeah i hate him way more than i hate selig

yeah seeing goodell finish a very distant third up there just looks ridiculous now. just a complete joke of a man, almost wonder if tagliabue set goodell up to provide a long term argument to the 'he was no pete rozelle' talk he got when he retired. the problems baseball has - loss of viewers, relevance, aging of market - are things you can't really blame him for. cancelling the world series hurt the sport's popularity more than steroids but its effects were shaken off pretty quickly. stern's obv the most important historically to his sport and deserves alot of credit but should've retired years ago, there are alot of black marks on that record and most of them came in the past ten years or so.

Selig is a putz

“If you look at the numbers, including in the Native American community, in a Native American community poll nine out of 10 supported the name. Eight out of 10 Americans in the general population would not like us to change the name. So we’re listening and being respectful for people who disagree, but let’s not forget this is the name of a football team.”

lmao

i watched the goodell thing and there was this amazing cringe comedy moment where he goes 'i can't control the weather--' and then fake snow starts coming down around him while hes giving this aint i a stinker grin

"Native American" community? Why not just say R</I>edskins community?

Whoops, almost gave away the secret to that.