ok the dangerous teenage hug epidemic - another important new york times trend piece

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2009/05/26/us/28hugs_600.JPG

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/28/style/28hugs.html

this newspaper is so strange

(catching up from other thread)

Girls embracing girls, girls embracing boys, boys embracing each other — the hug has become the favorite social greeting when teenagers meet or part these days. Teachers joke about “one hour” and “six hour” hugs, saying that students hug one another all day as if they were separated for the entire summer.

A measure of how rapidly the ritual is spreading is that some students complain of peer pressure to hug to fit in. And schools from Hillsdale, N.J., to Bend, Ore., wary in a litigious era about sexual harassment or improper touching — or citing hallway clogging and late arrivals to class — have banned hugging or imposed a three-second rule.

― would you ask tom petty that? (tipsy mothra), Thursday, May 28, 2009 2:06 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

the concerned adults in that article all sound like hank hill to me.

― would you ask tom petty that? (tipsy mothra), Thursday, May 28, 2009 2:07 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

"look, i know we said 'HUGS NOT DRUGS.' but we didn't really mean HUGS. we just needed to rhyme with DRUGS."

― would you ask tom petty that? (tipsy mothra), Thursday, May 28, 2009 2:07 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I seem to recall reading not too long ago about a Chicago suburban junior high that had actually banned hugs from school hallways.

― Bianca Jagger (jaymc), Thursday, May 28, 2009 3:44 PM (50 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Those fucking kids! God, how AREN'T our kids assing things up these days?

― cant go with u too many alfbrees (Abbott), Thursday, May 28, 2009 3:50 PM (44 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

You can't make this up:

“And there doesn’t seem to be any other overt way in which they acknowledge knowing each other,” she continued, describing the scene at her older son’s school in Manhattan. “No hi, no smile, no wave, no high-five — just the hug. Witnessing this interaction always makes me feel like I am a tourist in a country where I do not know the customs and cannot speak the language."

― Bud Huxtable (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, May 28, 2009 3:59 PM (35 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

the last line is pure Scalia.

― Bud Huxtable (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, May 28, 2009 3:59 PM (35 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

ok this clearly needs its own thread

― ice cr?m, Thursday, May 28, 2009 4:34 PM (41 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I think this is only dangerous if combined with Roman Arse stabbing.

what the hell

i wonder why newspapers are going bankrupt

hug-related asphyxiation is more of a problem than you think.

“The high-five is, like, boring.”

btw, feel like hugging as standard issue teenage greeting has been the norm since i was in like 8th grade???

"Hugging. How ethnic."

or if not the norm, then a whatever acceptable practice

this is possibly one of the craziest pairs of paragrpahs ever

Parents, who grew up in a generation more likely to use the handshake, the low-five or the high-five, are often baffled by the close physical contact. “It’s a wordless custom, from what I’ve observed,” wrote Beth J. Harpaz, the mother of two boys, 11 and 16, and a parenting columnist for The Associated Press, in a new book, “13 Is the New 18.”

“And there doesn’t seem to be any other overt way in which they acknowledge knowing each other,” she continued, describing the scene at her older son’s school in Manhattan. “No hi, no smile, no wave, no high-five — just the hug. Witnessing this interaction always makes me feel like I am a tourist in a country where I do not know the customs and cannot speak the language.”

20 years ago in my suburban boston jr high hugs were v popular too

baffled by hugs

Washington Times reporting that the epidemic began with 50 Cent's "In Da Club" with the infamous "so come gimme a hug" line, calling for a ban on rap music

hugging is a nice tender thing to do - i still hug all my friends

you never hug me

i wonder why newspapers are going bankrupt

looooooooooooooooooooooooooooool

next time i see u max i will hug u ;)

hug foods

hug life

the NY Times is quoting a parenting columnist for authority

smothered in hugs

is this what new york is really like or something

the nicest city on earth!

*hug*

this has me dreaming of a world where people are just kind and sweet to each other *sniffle*

huggest ban

hug u

huggest hug

hughug hug

hugging is a nice tender thing to do - i still hug all my friends

You always hug the one you love/ the one you shouldn't hug at all

what other fine articles has Sarah Kershaw brought us?

WOW PEOPLE BUY STUFF FROM SKYMALL EVEN THO THE COUNTRY IS BROKE
DADS ARE THE NEW MOMS
DRUNKOREXIA

now link to the respective ilx threads about the articles

Drunkorexia is not an official medical term.

THANK YOUS

being a nyt trend writer is pretty much the best job in the world as far as i can tell

it's like writing for the onion

I don't drink to offset the calories in my alcohol, I refrain from eating to make myself a cheaper drunk. This is called "creative problem solving" and is rewarded in any other walk of life. Certainly at my job, where they would probably lock any given assistant in a storage closet and wall it up, if they thought it would save money and the work would still get done.

haaa the today show is on the case http://gawker.com/5271997/today-investigates-high-school-hug-madness

Gah, I meant, I don't starve myself to offset the calories in my alcohol. Oh fuck it, you know what I meant.

i'm scared of an Al Queida attack now. remember the summer before 2001, everyone was freaking out about SHARKS. maybe it's

THE SUMMER OF THE HUG.

DADS ARE THE NEW MOMS

plz plz plz plz confirm that this is not a childbirth article

you'll have to click and find out

fwiw, i def know a dude who is a drunkorexic---like, "no I didn't eat lunch today, but I am going to have a million beers" and is very upfront about it. it's weird?

ok lol in the sidebar on the DRUNKOREXIA article:

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2009/05/13/theater/Critics600.jpg

Find the one that's different!

DRUNKOREXIA HAS MANY FORMS

I am starting to think Geoffrey Rush has a "silly facial prosthetic" clause in his contract, similar to Samuel L. Jackson's "fucked-up hair" clause.

dont know if its been mentioned enough that this was a front-page story for the new york times

Va. School's No-Contact Rule Is a Touchy Subject

Fairfax County middle school student Hal Beaulieu hopped up from his lunch table one day a few months ago, sat next to his girlfriend and slipped his arm around her shoulder. That landed him a trip to the school office.

Among his crimes: hugging.

Connecticut School Bans Physical Contact

East Shore M.S. Outlaws "High-Fives," "Hugging" And Horseplay Of Any Kind; Violators May Face Expulsion
MILFORD, Conn. (CBS) ―

A Connecticut middle school principal has laid down the law: You put your hands on someone -- anyone -- in any way, you're going to pay.

G-20 Gossip: No Touching, Please

According to video of the Obamas visit to Buckingham Place today, the First Lady briefly touched Queen Elizabeth on the back during a reception there for G-20 leaders, and that is, apparently, a huge social no-no. We just turned on SkyNews, which was airing a panel on the apparent faux pas. “You don’t touch the queen!” one red-face analyst insisted. “You don’t touch her!”

"Hugging. How ethnic."

― caek, Thursday, May 28, 2009 6:40 PM (32 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

"what is this, the italian parliament?"

god help us all that this merits trend pieces

and i thought UK newspapers had the market cornered on dumbass moral panics

http://gentlepony.com/pics/nuclear-arms3_green.gif

(anything you can't accomplish with nuclear arms is obv kinda suspect)

http://www.photobasement.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/huglife.jpg

^^^^^^^ "know" the person with that, BTW

do you hug her?

nnnooooooooooo

The hipster bandanna and the green waist/fanny-pack take it from mostly lol to kinda sad.

A friend in response to the hug story:

"So this is what happens as the New York Times dies? The travel budget doesn't allow them to go and cover real stories, so the farthest they can go is Montvale, NJ?"

by 'know' i mean that she is an 'active member of the chicago cycling community, so we've maybe met'

i like the existence of this article. i've been noticing something with regard to hugs -- i generally like them a lot but i'm also a fan of knowing when you just don't have to.

Ha, this article totally made my morning, actually. My favorite bit is the mother's complaint:

“I hug people I’m close to. But now you’re hugging people you don’t even know. Hugging used to mean something.”

HUGGING USED TO MEAN SOMETHING

Yah gbx, I was hoping you meant "biblically", but it seemed unlikely, so...

xp lol straight out of the "society is in the gutter" thread

WHEN I WAS YOUNG HUGGING WAS A SPECIAL, PRIVATE THING YOU DID WITH YOUR HUSBAND OR GRANDPARENTS

WHY BUY THE COW WHEN YOU CAN HUG IT FOR FREE

lol too good

http://rlv.zcache.com/cow_hugger_customized_tshirt-p235980188855609446ncgq_210.jpg

yeah, def not laurel, as the lady in question is actually trans-gendered iirc

> “Bromance,” which is now a widely used term for affection between straight male friends.

Easily as widely used as "man-date"!

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poll

#4 was actually kind of good. It trailed off when the auth had to decide what point he was making, but it didn't suck.

I thought the internet was going to put an end to human contact

actually thought this article was interesting. I grew up in jersey, where eye contact with strangers was considered verboten and acquaintances who wanted to hug you were to be eyed with deep distrust and suspicion. the point made about the virtual world causing an unusual overcompensation in the physical world is an interesting one, as is the point about parental overprotection and playgroups encouraging trust among youth. interesting enough that I wish there were more exploration of the implications than the standard "kids say no big d, parents freaked", and maybe some examples from somewhere else besides montclair and manhattan (nyt travel budget haw).

glad you guys are wringing lols out of it tho

edward you sound kinda bummed about this, maybe you need a hug

touch me and I'll shiv you

Hugging - the new "electronica"

thinking about my own social circle, I hang with people ranging from early 20s to early 40s and I have to say hugging is much more predominant among those on the younger end

also more predominant among the drunks

So that's everyone then.

drunks with hugs

I mean everyone I know.

While social mores may shift rapidly in our modern "hookup culture," etiquette dictates that hugging is the preferred method of greeting at a "rainbow party"

At a more formal "pharm party," however, you should simply introduce yourself via text

actually laurel I classify my friends as the drinkies, the drinkers, and the drunks

drunks are a very special and rarefied breed

tbh i find it genuinely disturbing that ANYBODY is getting worked up about hugging

what if yr having a particularly intense hug w/someone you kinda "like"

then they can usually tell, if you're a dude

(boner)

this is why dudes never hugged in jersey

hug-n-tug

lb I find it disturbing that you are disturbed

- teenage hugidemic - give me some space plz

haha yeah, the first thing in my head when reading this story was that there are surely

(a) a group of popular kids whose hugging is most noticed by staff/adults,
(b) a second tier of less-popular kids whose hugging rarely overlaps with the popular huggers, and
(c) a bunch of kids who NEVER GET HUGGED BY ANYONE

http://www.cnn.com/US/9802/13/hugging.ban/

^1998

a good reporter would have pulled a quote from that last group, because I would find it super-informative as a reader to see a news story containing genuine teenage sneering about this issue, and in general about who thinks they're so cool with their stupid hugging but really they're just dumb jerks

aw

: /

maybe you need a hug

― dulce est desipere in loco (Euler), Thursday, May 28, 2009 6:44 PM (37 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

they are all on e

http://www.mystcommunity.com/board/style_emoticons/b/hug.gif

they are all on e

― cool app (uh oh I'm having a fantasy), Thursday, May 28, 2009 3:24 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

this happened to me in hs

hug ep-E-demic

someone please update the nyt via comment

If my junior high students represent the next shock troops of the hug-a-bunch offensive, then it will peter out. btw, let's hope there is never a peter-out offensive.

there was a few months during my sophomore year of high school that i was all about hugging people, including acquaintances i wasn't even that close with. of course there was no trend at the time so it was really just inappropriate. :\

it all ended when my older bro yelled at me to stop hugging people in our (same) chemistry class and i was overcome with shame. :( :( :(

i won the chemistry award that year but i'm pretty sure it was not for all the hugging i did.

tell me he was wearing protective goggles at the time

it's possible because i think i was hugging my lab partner at the time

there was a few months during my sophomore year of high school that i was all about hugging people, including acquaintances i wasn't even that close with. of course there was no trend at the time so it was really just inappropriate. :\

^^^ my best friend in HS went through a very long phase w/this

i've been hanging out with a bunch of mfa grad students and they are huggy as fuck

Important: which discipline?

i met my girlfriend's friend's boyfriend the other week--he goodbye-hugged me after coffee. i was a little surprised tbh.

were you all http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/5673/fgulls527.gif

I am huggy if you're already a friend and if I really like you. What gets me if when people I've met once and don't really know at all start hugging me goodbye and stuff. I'm not so into that. We just met - we're not at the hugging stage yet!

i met my girlfriend's friend's boyfriend the other week--he goodbye-hugged me after coffee. i was a little surprised tbh.

― hugging used to mean something (call all destroyer), Thursday, May 28, 2009 3:42 PM (42 seconds ago) Bookmark

YES - EXACTLY!!

at what duration does a *hug* become a *cuddle*

Don't cuddles have more hand action?

10 seconds

Around the 7 to 8 second mark, I'd say.

after the expiration of the "huggle" zone

cuddles are generally horizontal, or at least sitting down.

i think its when the person starts to rub your back or really any hand/arm mvmnt at all once the hug has been formed

I am huggy if you're already a friend and if I really like you. What gets me if when people I've met once and don't really know at all start hugging me goodbye and stuff. I'm not so into that. We just met - we're not at the hugging stage yet!

yeah i guess it's a gray area--like i hugged the gf's f (who i've met a bunch of times) but since i just met this guy he's more in the handshake zone. and he's an acquaintance's sig other--who knows if i'm ever gonna see him again?

Important: which discipline?

mostly poets (obv), some writers

yeah a cuddle is a moving hug

it goes hug - huggle - cuddle - snuggle - "hooking up"

add motion and they are, respectively, hug - feeling up - heavy petting - grope - dry hump

wait, those are backward

hug - feeling up - groping - (something) - dry humping

lol

"grinding on" is somewhere in there

x-post to CAD - Yeah, exactly. You just met and had coffee. It wasn't as if you had some marathon bonding session or went through something traumatic together. In my mind that's definitely still handshake zone.

not yet, but trying

xp

is "feeling up" above the waist and "groping" below?

also "french kissing" is missing

hug - feeling up - groping - (something) - dry humping

batters box - first base - second base - third base - sacrifice fly

wait, those are backward

hug - feeling up - groping - (something) - dry humping

― nabisco, Thursday, May 28, 2009 2:50 PM (58 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Where does Dutch Rudder fall into this?

cuddling w/o moving

lol i like the direction this is taking guys

am i gonna have to google dutch rudder

http://www.crayola.com/lesson-plans/detail/metric-hugs-lesson-plan/

Where does Dutch Rudder fall into this?

say it in baseball *shakes fist*

Dutch Rudder is a good character actor but I don't see how he's relevant

Dan I would say "feeling up" is just that - feeling or lightly touching whereas "groping" sort of connotes more action. I think both could be used to describe above the waist action but that groping is def more involved.

Dutch Rudder, didn't they play the second stage at Lollapalooza one year?

Hugging isn't mentioned in the bible, so it's only logical that it's getting banned everywhere.

feeling up=you have permission
groping=you do not have permission

that's is IT
there is no way I'm bringing a child into THIS WORLD

x-post I think that one can grope with permission under certain circumstances.

(oops. sorry. http://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=embrace&qs_version=9 )

the ol' five finger hug

you do not have sufficient grope permissions to access this file

a good reporter would have pulled a quote from that last group, because I would find it super-informative as a reader to see a news story containing genuine teenage sneering about this issue, and in general about who thinks they're so cool with their stupid hugging but really they're just dumb jerks
― nabisco, Thursday, May 28, 2009 2:19 PM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Amen.

I can only think of one condition and one instance under which hugging occurred between my peers in middle school and high school: when couples spent the entire lunch period in sloppy kisses and serious dry humping in the hall and my two female high school classmates who were outspoken about not being lovers (Sarah was a cheerleader and Buffy (I'm not making it up) was a basketball player). I had public speaking class w/ them and they hugged before and after every single class.

But yeh, hugs would have been sooo out of place in my schools.

pretty sure when i was in high school the theater kids and goth kids were the only ones hugging it up

maybe they got the idea from my so called life or something

ugh, my grandfather had a dutch rudder on his hand, it was really fuckin gross

Wait - now that I think of it, there were probably a couple drama kids who hugged. Ugh.

maybe they got the idea from my so called life or something

ha!

i like hugs!

nabisco xp: this article would have been better if it addressed hugging as leading to social stratification or if there are ethnic/racial issues or how it affects autistic kids. The hugging thing vs. the rise of autism spectrum diagnosis ... or even better, cases of hugging gone wrong. Hugging leading to stalking. Kids that hug wrong.

Kids that hug wrong.

the mind boggles

this article is completely perfect the way it is - btw i just read it like 10 mins ago

as i recall when i went to HS (early/mid 90s) this worked strictly along gender lines. girls hugged--usually each other, occasionally guys. guys never hugged one another, and rarely if ever initiated hugs with girls.

rosario speedwagon

dude

oh shit did you use that one already doh

lb I find it disturbing that you are disturbed

― 鬼の手 (Edward III), Thursday, May 28, 2009 7:07 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

why?

i recall this working pretty much as amtst described. my sister & her friends hugged, the guys never did unless it was some kind of flirtation initiated by the lady.

when does a cuddle become a snuggle, or vice versa?

thought they were synonymous.

handshakes are like hugs for your hands

hugs are like handshakes for your body

not sure where milkshakes fit into the equation

your penis

oh shit did you use that one already doh

no. i'm in awe!

let's leave your penis out of this

(that's what she said)

your penis

― the stanky leg

appropriate username?

oh in that case...

xp i thought that's what that song was about

more xposts

at what duration does a *hug* become a *cuddle*

the dangerous teenage hug epidemic vs the cuddle puddle

i would hug my female friends in hs, only hugged male hs friends after we graduated.

At the end of a semester my evil improv/drama teacher who had made many of my friends miserable for months hugged me and it was traumatizing.

fwiw i don't see much (if any) evidence of this at my kid's middle school, yesterday AM this girl he love/hates came up and punched him 'hello'

guys i found something worse

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/31/nyregion/31clothesline.html?_r=1&hp=&pagewanted=all

everybody hugs in my office, btw

kinda want a powerhug with r giant hands kelly (pictured above)

mounted on r kelly's hands: a kitchen wallclock, a small recently felled log and a finger mounted crystal decanter

Have I mentioned what a hug maniac my 15-yr-old brother is? He has his own style of hug, which he calls 'Cars0n hugs' after himself, which involve squeezing the fucking shit out of you for a good 10 seconds. He's so wicked affectionate, it is just crazy.

Last night he was telling me in his speech class, a student gave a speech about how some of his best friends got kidnapped, raped and murdered when they were in elementary school. "It was so SAD, I needed some hugs but hardly anyone would give me one." My hypothesis, that it was bcz people like breathing while being hugged, was wrong. It turns out he's doing an 'I'm creepy and weird' gambit lately where he breathes on people's necks ans stabs his arm to make blood squirt onto his notebooks. •_•

His peers don't find him especially huggable bcz of this.

I am not sure I understand what is happening there

I blame My Chemical Romance

<3 yr new nickname, crütz

I just saw these two people downtown

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3352/3577087214_754c6920a7_o.jpg

In case you can't make out the signs, they say "FREE HUGS"

HUGS $1

The free hugs people were all over Boston last summer. Creepy.

I wonder if I could haggle for a kiss too.

http://www.redwinebuzz.com/winesooth/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/joe-george-bush-picture-1-2.jpg

Rarely is the question asked, is our children hugging?

OMG that article Mr. Que found! Shocking.

seriously, what is the premise of that article? is it really just

http://cache.gawker.com/assets/resources/2007/12/siren.gif CLOTHESLINES EXIST http://cache.gawker.com/assets/resources/2007/12/siren.gif ?

I can't tell what on earth it's trying to say otherwise and don't know why the fuck you'd pitch, research, write, place, sub and publish that story. "HOLD THE FRONT PAGE, we've discovered kettles, plumbing and potplants!"

In this week's Sunday supplement: 22,000 words on DID YOU KNOW: some of YOUR NEIGHBOURS don't live in caves?

Years ago, she had another clothesline outside the bathroom, one that stretched to the building next door. Ms. Schill shared the line with the woman in the opposite apartment, an unlikely connection on the thinnest of strings. The other woman died, and eventually the line was removed.

Ms. Schill misses that clothesline sometimes. And her neighbor, too.

OK I am going to comment on this from a cultural perspective, based on my own experience. I am from Mexico where, as in most Latin America, people touch each other all the time. It has nothing to do -at least on a conscious level- with sexuality. It is just a way social bonding I guess. I was honestly a bit shocking, after coming to Canada (where I've lived for the past six years) people hardly hug or touch each other at all. Even among close friends. I must say that during my first long harsh winter (while I wasn't seeing anyone) I could have done with a little more physical contact.

we welcome you to 77.

?

what's your login email so we may have you join us on 77?

77 being...?

its a hug emoticon duc?

http://barnabasnagy.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/skull_and_crossbones_c1947_ghw_bush_left_of_clock.jpg

xp

77 is the colloquial term for a ILX board that isn't visible to the general public but does a very good job of being exactly like ILE only with more emoness

OK I am going to comment on this from a cultural perspective, based on my own experience. I am from Mexico where, as in most Latin America, people touch each other all the time. It has nothing to do -at least on a conscious level- with sexuality. It is just a way social bonding I guess. I was honestly a bit shocking, after coming to Canada (where I've lived for the past six years) people hardly hug or touch each other at all. Even among close friends. I must say that during my first long harsh winter (while I wasn't seeing anyone) I could have done with a little more physical contact.

― touch my bum / this is life (daavid), Monday, June 22, 2009 4:55 PM (31 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i guess u don't live in quebec? everyone hugs and kisses each other on the cheek here

ha ha u live in gaytown

yea more like montregay

I do actually, but on the anglo side of Montreal.

xpost

daavid, go to the "boards" section and check out 7Curtis's 7borad

OK, thanks!

'emoness'??

dont cry about it

im going to make a private 77 thred about how im ;_;

OK I never read that clothesline article before now. Its an Onion piece someone misplaced, right?

me neither. fuck a dryer imo

And I thought the "hey look, hipsters all wear chunky black framed glasses! Even when they DONT NEED TO!" wank in last weeks Age was bad enough.

EXCELLENT message/username combination, daavid.

And in other fake trends, a "Facebook Exodus"

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/30/magazine/30FOB-medium-t.html?em

The article itself admits that the numbers don't back this up. How do they feel comfortable reporting this?

heffernan does not report, she babbles nonsense about stuff she's heard from her friends and family.

yeah doesn't she have her own personal fact checker on staff? amazing she's still employed

She obviously wants it to be true.

huh, i had always figured her for being a good bit older than 40. i guess she's just dumb.

One person shut down her account because she disliked how nosy it made her. Another thought the scene had turned desperate. A third feared stalkers. A fourth believed his privacy was compromised. A fifth disappeared without a word.

The exodus is not evident from the site’s overall numbers.

sentences like that are how nazi germany started basically

a small but noticeable group are fleeing

Another thought the scene had turned desperate.
Another thought the scene had turned desperate.
Another thought the scene had turned desperate.

I think she needs a hug.

Virginia Heffernan thinks the scene has turned desperate

ILXodus

Mr. Que's posts had turned desperate.

don't they know about "hide posts" functionz

Another friend, who didn’t want his name used, found that Facebook undermined his whole notion of online friendship.

seriously "web service with 150 million users has a few malcontents" is in actual fact Not Fit To Print

guys she does this pretty much every week.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Heffernan

Heffernan began her career as a fact-checker with The New Yorker magazine.
Heffernan began her career as a fact-checker with The New Yorker magazine.
Heffernan began her career as a fact-checker with The New Yorker magazine.
Heffernan began her career as a fact-checker with The New Yorker magazine.
Heffernan began her career as a fact-checker with The New Yorker magazine.
Heffernan began her career as a fact-checker with The New Yorker magazine.

http://2009.sxsw.com/files/u13/VirginiaHeffernan.jpg

dumb AND cute!

i'd check her facts.

Que is thinking of Alessandra Stanley, isn't he?

I don't know if this qualifies as bogus-trend "reporting" cause it was in Heffernan's column in the magazine, which is very much not "reported."

Que is thinking of Alessandra Stanley, isn't he?

Yes. Both have written about TV for the Times.

which also BTW is way less cringy than I'd ever have imagined when it started! I think I've actually enjoyed a few weeks

huh, i had always figured her for being a good bit older than 40.

I think it must be the name. I first read her in Slate, so she didn't seem terribly old.

Que is thinking of Alessandra Stanley, isn't he?

CORRECTION

A post on Monday afternoon incorrectly named Virginia Heffernan as having her own personal fact checker on the New York Times. It is Alessandra Stanley who was the fact-checker, not Heffernan.

who has

haha

- Heffernan began her career as a fact-checker with The New Yorker magazine.
- It is Alessandra Stanley who was the fact-checker, not Heffernan.

hahaha

so confused

It doesn't surprise me too much that people in Heffernan's age cohort have mixed feelings about Facebook. They're a group that definitely has a big Facebook presence (as opposed to the generation above them), but they've only really joined the site within the last year or two, and the notion of living online is not as second-nature to them as it is to their Gen Y counterparts. Of course, Heffernan's article never considers this.

i would totally agree with that

My friend Alex joined four years ago at the suggestion of “the coolest guy on the planet,” she told me in an e-mail message. For a while, they cultivated a cool-planet online gang. But then Scrabulous was shut down, someone told her she was too old for Facebook, her teenage stepson seemed to be losing his life to it and she found the whole site crawling with mercenaries trying to sell books and movies. “If I am going to waste my time on the Internet,” she concluded, “it will be playing in online backgammon tournaments.”

Blech

haha dude, man, is there something specific in that you're calling our attention to, or is it just the noise?

Another thought the scene had turned desperate.

This ain't a scene it's a login.

Just the whole thing. How could someone write a paragraph like that and not think "I am the world's biggest douchebag"?

because of writing declarative sentences about somebody else?

don't get me wrong, I prefer serial commas too, but it's a newspaper, whatchagonnado

For a while, they cultivated a cool-planet online gang.

this is crucial

Well he was "the coolest guy on the planet" according to her friend Alex's email message.

how DARE the INTERNET try to sell us (shudder) BOOKS AND MOVIES~!!!!!@!?????!!!

yeah I mean I can get finding the piece thin or useless, but that paragraph is just relaying someone's story as told to the writer, so ... eh?

i agree with you though Alex--paragraphs like that, what can you say about them except? Blech. I mean, it's just horrible journalism. Or should I say "journalism." It's like third rate blog writing.

Que it's a column

Well he was "the coolest guy on the planet" according to her friend Alex's email message.

― Alex in SF, Monday, August 31, 2009 11:03 PM (56 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

when the dude from the Dos Equis commercial says join facebook, you join facebook

so they had problems with ads for books and movies and not for teeth whiteners, weight loss, and dating sites?

it may be a column, it still has no place in the New York Times. I used to love reading my hometown average guy suburban type columns when I was in high school. that paragraph is just bullshit piled on top of heresay on top of nonsense.

...wrapped in an enigma.

with a dollop of sour cream on top

i could go for some potato skins round about now how about you guys?

Ten minutes to the end of the workday, I'm with you.

Ian don't try to sell me stuff on the web.

they cultivated a cool-planet online gang.

this makes these people seem extremely lame ... and like they still have some inadequacies carried over from the 7th grade lunch table.

Shit I have bacon and cheddar cheese at home. This could lead to something good....

I think everyone here needs to compare/contrast with this week's back-end Lives, which if I remember correctly was about a white guy teaching English in Japan who slowly realized that when Japanese women told him he'd gained wait it wasn't an insult and was actually somewhat playful

(as in like I'm curious which piece people would prefer)

He'd gained what?

My friend Alex joined four years ago at the suggestion of “the coolest guy on the planet,” she told me in an e-mail message. For a while, they cultivated a cool-planet online gang.

i have absolutely no idea what this means. what is a "cool-planet online gang"? she says these things like normal people are supposed to understand them. who was the guy and why was he so cool? are we just supposed to take virginia heffernan's friend alex at his word?

But then Scrabulous was shut down,

wasn't this because they were infringing on a copyright? was facebook only worth it if you could play word games over a period of weeks?

someone told her she was too old for Facebook,

why smash a dumb sterotype when you can accept it?

she found the whole site crawling with mercenaries trying to sell books and movies.

i have been on facebook essentially since it started and have no idea what she's talking about.

“If I am going to waste my time on the Internet,” she concluded, “it will be playing in online backgammon tournaments.”

ok at least that's otm.

she found the whole site crawling with mercenaries

http://www.gonemovies.com/WWW/MyWebFilms/Oorlog/ApocalypseWillardModder.jpg

xp - and aren't there like a dozen faux-scrabble facebook games anyway?

He'd gained where?

xp Yeah, but that was the most copywrite infringing so. . .

he'd gained. . . wait! that wasn't an insult!

that lives piece was fine iirc. i mean "lives" is basically for goofy shit like that (or sad shit about like parents with alzheimer's)

at least it tells a story and is not just like "hey this is what my friend said and this is what my other friend said"

the great thing is i don't have to pick which one i'd prefer--i still think this one is stupid

xp alex - but it isn't like they were suddenly unable to play internet scrabble ...

if no scrabulous was really a deal breaker i guess that's fine, i mean i don't know.....

at least it tells a story and is not just like "hey this is what my friend said and this is what my other friend said"

very crucial here^^^

gained WEIGHT, pardon

haha I'm so confused by y'all picking that paragraph apart -- it's a straightforward summary of some woman's stated experience with Facebook as relayed to the writer; is this really that weird? I mean, I dunno, would you really prefer to have your intelligence insulted by having such things be ILX-friendly and go

My friend Alex joined four years ago (LOL) at the suggestion of “the coolest guy on the planet” (yeah right like she knows anything about who's cool), she told me in an e-mail message. For a while, they cultivated a cool-planet online gang.* But then Scrabulous was shut down, someone told her she was too old for Facebook (she totally is, and lame too), her teenage stepson seemed to be losing his life to it (LOL what about the children) and she found the whole site crawling with mercenaries trying to sell books and movies. “If I am going to waste my time on the Internet,” she concluded, “it will be playing in online backgammon tournaments.” (OMG LOL BACKGAMMON what a dumb fuck my friend Alex is let's all laugh at her)

* note that this one is already readable as kinda scare-quoted and potentially sarcastic

what's the difference between scrabulous and all the other ones that are basically the same concept?

well is she trying to come up with reasons why one might actually leave facebook or is she just repeating things she has been told? when i say i don't know what she means i'm not exaggerating--those sentences do not make any sense to me.

is this really that weird? I mean, I dunno, would you really prefer to have your intelligence insulted by having such things be ILX-friendly and go

it's not a binary. it's not one way or the other. why are you wasting time trying to defend a piece of writing when it obviously struck a nerve with some of us?

if she wanted to come up w/reasons to leave facebook, then fuck, do some actual reporting and find some valid ones. if you just want to regurgitate things get a blog not a nyt column.

let's defend vacuity

(I mean like I said, I get disliking the column, but that fairly neutral paragraph is like ... I dunno, it's like hating an ordinary brick in a building you dislike, you know?)

xpost - haha I'm not so much defending a piece of writing as marveling at various interpretations of it -- also dude you spent like two hours every weekday picking on various stuff I post, so let's not get into productive-use-of-time issues here

nabisco....are...you.......trolling?

this is disturbing like when you were a kid and the bad superman showed up on superfriends

"what's the difference between scrabulous and all the other ones that are basically the same concept?"

Scrabulous was more copyright infringing and thus cooler for the people on planet cool.

also dude you spent like two hours every weekday picking on various stuff I post, so let's not get into productive-use-of-time issues here

huh?

You forgot to scare quote "friend" in your ILX-version above, nabisco.

this is just a seriously mediocre article ... it isn't even wtf enough to qualify as a wannabe onion article, like the hug epidemic one.

me, trolling? I'm the one who thinks it's an ordinary paragraph about how a woman that age might relate to Facebook! I mean I basically agree with Jaymc that the whole flaw about the column (besides just being kinda *shrug*) is it's about a specific age group and social sphere's relationship with Facebook, not the world's; haha but I feel somewhat left out on why it's interesting or mockable that the Times would run a column sorta from the viewpoint of professionals 5-15 years older than me, or that one of them would say in an email that she he has this cool-guy type friend

"(I mean like I said, I get disliking the column, but that fairly neutral paragraph is like ... I dunno, it's like hating an ordinary brick in a building you dislike, you know?)"

I think I just find her "friend" Alex more repellant than you do, nabisco. It's cool. You don't have to hate all the Alex's, I do.

does she even say how old these people are though?

Comma at the end of that second sentence makes it more amusing hah.

Old enough to have a teenage stepson so pretty fucking old.

Also too old to use Facebook.

Old enough to play backgammon.

uh, the key word is stepson ... she? could be younger ...

people are going to have *widely* different reactions to a piece of writing like this, and honestly, i don't see what's so remarkable about that.

I feel like if you really hate the building, you should hate the individual bricks at least a little bit

xxp She's not. She's an old Alex with an older stepson. I can just feel it.

It's an Alex sense I have.

i dunno a better column might be like "she thinks she's too old but actually shitloads of old ppl use facebook" or "she thinks the site is overrun with mercenaries but actually they let over-40s download adblock too." like what's the point of letting her write about technology, even the social aspects of it, since she doesn't know any more about it than lots of poorly-informed people?

xp Alex: y'know Paul1ne Ol1veros is on facebook ...

xp A better column would have died stillborn in the writer's mind.

I am not on Facebook. Too old.

Also I heard it's not cool anymore.

My friend Walter told me that.

oh WAIT, Alex in SF, you are hating on the FRIEND?

that's been part of my confusion, cause you said:

How could someone write a paragraph like that and not think "I am the world's biggest douchebag"?

which reads like you're primarily hating on Heffernan for neutrally passing along the friend's tale (which you can do too, obviously)

He plays Risk Online now.

I like the paragraph that begins by describing the person as an eloquent writer, and then the quote isn't particularly eloquent.

can i be really really bitchy for a second and say that the thing i dislike the most about this column is that it begins with yet one more goddamn use of that Yeats quote?

xp nabisco: if that person were actually a friend, I wouldn't pass on the tale because it makes them look annoying.

can i get a cool planet invite?

heffernan's friend is dumb and heffernan seems to passively accept what she says as fact.

xp no dude cool planet disbanded iirc

does she even say how old these people are though?

No, but I'm guessing that a random sampling of her friends is mostly going to include people in her age group (she just turned 40).

uh, that's not that old ... half of my friends are in that age range ...

"which reads like you're primarily hating on Heffernan for neutrally passing along the friend's tale (which you can do too, obviously)"

It's the whole thing really. It's her friend, but also the way she's casually relating the whole thing. It just rubbed me the wrong way.

Blog post on Virginia Heffernan's wedding:
http://www.xtcian.com/arch/001618.php

uh, that's not that old ... half of my friends are in that age range ...

I never said it was. But it probably skews slightly old for Facebook.

That blog post makes me hate her even more.

bowtie guy is prob coolest guy on the planet
http://www.xtcian.com/RonJodiIan2VAWed(bl).jpg

slightly old for facebook doesn't seem to really matter anymore

That's her husband, isn't it?

xp alex (a few posts back) pretty much, yeah ... the whole thing reads like a hastily compiled list of reasons a few of the writer's friends quit facebook without any real point about generational differences, technological change, or interesting information

bowtie guy looks kinda familiar

I think bowtie guy is the author of the blog post.

actually - he looks like this douchey guy at my college who wore a suit every day to be "rebellious."

haha yeah okay see maybe this is my deeper issue: some woman gets an email from Heffernan asking why she quit Facebook -- she says oh, I joined cause my hip friend said it was awesome, but then the main application I liked got axed, someone called me old, my stepson got all Facebooked out, and eventually I was like screw it, I'll just play backgammon. this seems relatively normal and non-annoying to me, I guess; it seems like such a touchy bar for calling people out as annoying. I'm being way more annoying right now than that, just not in the Times.

since I'm being annoying I will add value with this actual screencap of "Alex"'s Facebook page and the REAL reason she quit:

http://emailsfromcrazypeople.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/Q6umM-500x392.jpg

I just assumed it was David Samuels. Photo captioning sucks on that thing.

xp nabisco: the way you phrased it is far less annoying than the phrasing in the article ...

nabisco, this also might not be as big a deal if it weren't for the fact that the nyt has been fairly routinely making up fads lately and this fits into that pattern

xp - Alex - I doubt that's the douchey suit guy, he just looks like him.

Scrabulous didn't even disappear, it just became Lexulous instead (with the same app and stats even kept, as far as I can make out).

Oh, multipost.

You are right. David Samuels appears to have an eating disorder like his wife.

there were significant changes made when scrabulous became lexulous, at least for users in the USA.

Also the thing I think silly about this article is more things like

"Another friend, who didn’t want his name used, found that Facebook undermined his whole notion of online friendship. “It’s easy to think of your circle of ‘Friends’ as a coherent circle, clear and moated, when in fact the splay of overlap/network makes drip/action painting a better (visual) analogy.”"

OMG! Online friendships might not be quite like real ones! OMG I spend too much time online and it's full of ads and vapid!

Hello, 2001 called?

is the Bogus Trend Story thing really more prevalent at the Times, or does the Times just catch more public shit for them? (that's a serious non-rhetorical question.) like today the WSJ is getting it over an article about people cutting their own hair.

(I guess the Times's do tend to be more embarrassing, in our world, since they often have to do with trends of hipness or style)

wall street journal trend pieces tend to be WAY worse in my experience--i remember one from last winter about people who wear sneakers at the office--but i think they, uh, suffer from the subtle bigotry of low expectations

Probably because the Times is the most prominent "serious" paper in the country they get more shit about bogus trend stories ... the SF Chronicle definitely has its fair share ...

I do think it's getting more prevalent - and ilx isn't the only one noticing (http://www.slate.com/id/2225301/)

Whether the WSJ / other crappy newspapers do it more often than the Times doesn't particularly matter, and that certainly doesn't excuse the Times for doing it.

you get them in the UK, but they don't have this deadly serious capital-J journalism tone.

i think times just gets the most shit on ilx becuase its the only paper most of us read

and yeah the chron does it like crazy, but it also doesn't have a great reputation anymore. the nyt is still taken seriously, but if they don't put a lid on this stuff, it's gonna hurt their rep in the long term. this is the 2nd most read article on nyt.com.

this is the 2nd most read article on nyt.com.

You realize this is why they keep publishing them, right?

right, well if the nyt wants to aim for page hits above uh, fact-based articles, they can do a lot better than this

they're usually spottable insofar as their tone's just weaselly and anecdotal and question-filled, like "could these uncertain indicators and observations maybe suggest that possibly X? Bob Abernathy thinks so, though he admits that statistics are vague; here is an interesting story about some guy that does X and says all his friends do too"

(the Heffernan absolutely does that, but I've always felt like a magazine column is the main spot that's acceptable)

in the print copy, it's pretty obv that there's a difference between the magazine and the newspaper, but the website doesn't particularly highlight that difference. I mean, it says 'magazine' on top, but I imagine 50% of the people who read this don't even know what the nyt magazine refers to.

but I imagine 50% of the people who read this don't even know what the nyt magazine refers to.

You don't?

http://www.xtcian.com/RonJodiIan2VAWed(bl).jpg

The walls between realities must be getting thin, bowtie guy is clearly alt-world Greg Kinnear.

Ladies and gentlemen

In her debut column, Virginia Heffernan writes about a series that explores both coal-mining narratives and reality TV.

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/04/03/mining-reality/

Welcome Back Virginia! A wonderful writer that truly understands the digital culture as well as the pop one, i followed 'Screens' & 'The Medium' , and was pleased to see your pic and news of this 'debut' column. Your voice has been missed in it's own space.

Perhaps the paywall went up so these people, including commenters, could be more readily isolated and contained.

this seems vaguely relevant here

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/lifestyle/the-other-side/william-duncan-state-school-bans-children-from-rolling-up-sleeves-on-jumpers/story-e6frfhk6-1226107452535

amazing picture with that story